4 mic-pre's and a drum kit...?

Andre · Post by **Andre** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 7:27 pm

Hello!

Let's just say I have 4 pretty decent mic-pre's and one pretty decent drumkit and I would like to get a good overall drum sound from only 4 mics. What microphones would you recommend and where would you recommend I put them?

Let's not talk budget etc. for now, I would some different ideas as starting points for further investigation.

I read on this board that Sufjan Stevens used an Altec 1592a for "Illinoise" which only has five inputs and I quite like the sound of the drums on that album so it seems possible, but I just need some pointers and recommendations.

Thanking you muchly...

mjau · Post by **mjau** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 7:33 pm

If it's me, and I'm shooting for something similar to how that album sounds, I'll go one overhead, one on the snare, one on the kick, and another a couple of feet in front of the kick.

I'm Painting Again · Post by **I'm Painting Again** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 7:39 pm

Andre just move those guys around till it sounds like you want it to..no rules!!

Start with one and get the best full kit sound you can then fill in with the other 3..watch for phase weirdness when you add the other 3..keep taking them out and comparing to the original one mic sound to see if it gets smaller and more shite or bigger or the same..sometimes using multiple mics can make it sound worse..you have to be conscious of those phase relationships..

Quest Poetics · Post by **Quest Poetics** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 7:42 pm

I'd do 2 overheads (or place them around the kit where they sound best) mic the kik and snare and your good...Seriously you can get a really good sound just from that....Also try to mic up the kick drum from the beater side under the low tom and the kick will really really cut through the mix as well as your lo tom...I personally use an AT4033 for that and absolutely love it...Use the 2 overheads / room mics as the main fingerprint of your drum sound and the snare mic as reinforcement to really let the snare cut through...Have fun...If you go to my website and listen to the song "Jah rise", I only used 4 mics on that drum kit...You'll notice that the kik & lo tom really stand out and thats only from the 4033 where I stated earlier...As for the Overheads I used 2 414's over the kit and a Beta 57 on the snare...4 Mics and no I'm no Albini but it's a useable sound...Have fun most of all and make sure you dont just settle...Keep fucking w/ the mics until you find what you like....Peace!

Ethan Holdtrue · Post by **Ethan Holdtrue** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 9:50 pm

Get a AT 4050 and set it to OMNI. Place it right in the dead center of the kit (between the snare and floor tom by the drumers knee), AKG D-122 on the bass drum, and maybe 2 sm-57's on the snare, or 1 57 on the side of the snare and a SM-81 as an overhead above the drummers head for added flavor. Throw in a dash of noise gate, and a spritsing of compression as needed and serve.

Prep time - 10 min
Will serve 4 to 5.

jjbohn · Post by **jjbohn** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 10:42 pm

Stereo Overheads, Snare, and Kick
Overheads => Whatever you think, too many options
Snare => SM57 or condenser with high max SPL rating
Kick => D112, RE20, FET 47, AT4050 (something standard)

If you end up wanting a litte more out of your snare sound you can reamp it later. You could also take two other mics and basically reamp the room. I've been meaning to do a limited mic project but everytime I end up coping out.

drumsound · Post by **drumsound** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 12:05 am

I'd probably use a room mic, and OH, BD and SD. If the music needed to be drier I might not use the room mic. If I felt I needed more "hi fi" I'd got for stereo OH maybe. The "Recorderman" two drumsticks high, one over the SD one by the drummers right ear can get a really great picture of the drum-set. Makes for a nice balance of drums and cymbals (as long as the drummer is good!). I like matching pres for the drums usually, something fast and punchy.

Don't forget to pick the right drums and cymbals...

angry · Post by **angry** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 12:12 am

I just recorded a 14 piece jazz orchestra.
Acoustic bass, drums, electric guitar, 3 trombones, 4 sax/flutes/clarinet, 3 trumpets and a tuba.
I recorded the drums with 3 mics.
Mic pres were Vintech 473's.
Overheads were Beyer mc-834's and in a "Recorderman/Fletcher/Glyn Johns" type placement.
And a Soundelux Ifet7 (in I mode) in front of the kick (full resonant head).
I think the drums sound awesome.
Of course the drummer is why it sounds so great, with 3 mics you can't really do much trickery and the drummer (for better or for worse) is in control of the dynamics.
We were hoping for an old school Mingus type sound.
I'm not sure if any of that was helpfull.

drumsound · Post by **drumsound** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 12:19 am

angry wrote:I just recorded a 14 piece jazz orchestra.
Acoustic bass, drums, electric guitar, 3 trombones, 4 sax/flutes/clarinet, 3 trumpets and a tuba.
I recorded the drums with 3 mics.
Mic pres were Vintech 473's.
Overheads were Beyer mc-834's and in a "Recorderman/Fletcher/Glyn Johns" type placement.
And a Soundelux Ifet7 (in I mode) in front of the kick (full resonant head).
I think the drums sound awesome.
Of course the drummer is why it sounds so great, with 3 mics you can't really do much trickery and the drummer (for better or for worse) is in control of the dynamics.
We were hoping for an old school Mingus type sound.
I'm not sure if any of that was helpfull.

There was an 834 at the studio where I used to work. I always wanted a second for OH. Another cool thing to do with that mic is to put it 4-5 feet from and pointing at the snare.

angry · Post by **angry** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 12:34 am

drumsound wrote:
angry wrote:I just recorded a 14 piece jazz orchestra.
Acoustic bass, drums, electric guitar, 3 trombones, 4 sax/flutes/clarinet, 3 trumpets and a tuba.
I recorded the drums with 3 mics.
Mic pres were Vintech 473's.
Overheads were Beyer mc-834's and in a "Recorderman/Fletcher/Glyn Johns" type placement.
And a Soundelux Ifet7 (in I mode) in front of the kick (full resonant head).
I think the drums sound awesome.
Of course the drummer is why it sounds so great, with 3 mics you can't really do much trickery and the drummer (for better or for worse) is in control of the dynamics.
We were hoping for an old school Mingus type sound.
I'm not sure if any of that was helpfull.
There was an 834 at the studio where I used to work. I always wanted a second for OH. Another cool thing to do with that mic is to put it 4-5 feet from and pointing at the snare.

Placed 4-5 feet in what direction?
I'm imagining somewhere between the hihat and kick.

xSALx · Post by **xSALx** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 2:05 am

1. 1 bass drum
2. 1 snare top
3. 1 snare bottom
4. 1 room about 10' away 8' up

that's the easy part. all you need now is:

a good room and a good drummer, if possible.

unfortunately without either one of those it's gonna be difficult. good luck. if you get both you're golden. that's with the assumption you can get the right positioning on all the mics.

as i record more and more i see the importance of a decent room- so try to at least get that.

kdownes · Post by **kdownes** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 5:52 am

if it is a small room, i would say to try two small diaphrams in an ortf configuration. place them about chest high out in front of the kit. this will get a good picture of the kit. then mic the kick and the snare for punch.

A.David.MacKinnon · Post by **A.David.MacKinnon** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 8:17 am

I'd do a Glyn Johns set up. One overhead above the snare (panned R), a mic by the floor tom pointed towards the snare (panned L), and a mic out front of the kick. Add a snare mic and your off to the races.
If the room is good I'd use ribbons for everything except the snare.

JWL · Post by **JWL** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 10:18 am

I was just gonna post something almost identical to junkshop's post. I'd get 3 identical ribbon mics (modded shinybox 46Cs would be cool) and put them in the Glyn Johns setup as he describes, or possibly the "Recorderman" variation.

The 4th mic would depend on what I was hearing with the above 3, once placed correctly (ie, no phasing issues, good sound in the room). But one of my current favorites is to use a "crotch mic," an SM57 or similar placed directly between the snare drum and the kick drum, pointed at the drummer's crotch. This crotch mic is GREAT for serious squishage.... its placement tends to pick up a lot of the kick and snare, and not much else (some hihat of course).

Though I've never tried a crotch mic with a figure-of-eight mic... another ribbon? Cool.....

A.David.MacKinnon · Post by **A.David.MacKinnon** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 11:06 am

YES!!!!!
The crotch mic rules! I use a EV 635a just above the beater side rim of the kick. I usualy use a Ross distortion pedal or a Rat as the pre for this mic. If you sneak it into the mix it makes the drums pop.
It doesn't work for every drummer but neither does the Glyn Johns set up.

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4 mic-pre's and a drum kit...?

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