Who's responsible for payment?

[garysun]

I've been recording a band that changed members mid-recording.
My contact from the band is no longer with them.
Neither are the other 2 that I worked with in the studio.
Who is responsible for the remaining balance due?
The new band members want to ditch the recordings because of the member change, but I'm not sure who to ask for payment???

[cgarges]

Man, that's a tough situation. What sort of relationship do you have with the guys who left? And if three of the guys you know aren't in the band any more, how many people ARE still left? Do they have copies of anything? How much is still due in relation to how much they've already paid you and how much time they've used?

Good question. I'll be curious to see where this goes.

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC

[garysun]

Unfortunately I don't have much of a relationship with this band as I've only met each member once.
There's only one that's left that I actually met.
There's a new member that's serving as the leader of the band, but we've never met.
They have copies of drums/bass with random clicks thrown in.
I had a feeling there would be some sort of problem with them from day one.
They owe one sessions worth.
At first the new members said they would pay it and were cool and apologetic.
I have since stopped hearing back from former and new members,
Has anyone had a similar experience?
It must be common with bands breaking up all the time.

[@?,*???&?]

I have this EXACT situation with one band at my studio right now. It's the only project that is in this limbo state right now. All others are moving ahead smoothly.

This is the first project I've had in that transpired like this.

The band has no copies of finished material and as a student of mine was engineering it, I made sure that what the band does have is unreleasable.

The band have a remaining balance due between $1K and $2K to get their mixes. The band are considering breaking up right now. 2 members have paid for everything up to this point and they are fed up with the other 2 who have paid nothing. Small claims court could be an option for me as a studio owner, but it would be just as easy to write it off on my taxes.

The point I tried to impress to all involved is that records have to be made quickly. Strike when the iron is hot and when all are enthused. The student was sort of producing. The band was sort of producing, but in reality, no one was producing. That is part of the problem.

I have attempted to impress upon these guys that this recording (and they have learned so much already) will be their first experience with college radio and releasing a manufactured disc. If they never pay up, they put off learning about of this new stuff that can make them a better band (whether with this line-up or not) in the future. I have also impressed the guys who have paid up to this point, that they can make money from now until forever with this disc IF it gets mastered, manufactured and comes out. They will recoup nothing if the band ends now.

They were on a pay as you go situation on this and the mixing got ahead of the payments. The band are ecstatic with the result, just have a few unemployed members right now.

[Track Rat]

I had just about the same situation about two weeks ago. I got lucky in that they paid what I thought was owed. I explained that the band is like a company in that who ever was or is in charge, the "company" incurred the debt and that they were still responsible, regardless who the members were. But it could have easily turned into a train wreck.

[garysun]

This is an interesting situation.Does anyone have any solutions?

I just got this email from my contact:

While I was the liaison for the --- band, coordinating activities and so on, the service was provided to the --- band. The --- band is the entity that was to receive service, not me. That would be like asking a secretary for a business to pay for services rendered to the business. It was my understanding that the --- band wanted to continue on with the demo.
Believe me I don't want to stick you, but what is right is right. I will also note that it was the drummer's overage that created the unpaid portion of the bill. As you know, the drummer is also not with the band, but perhaps he should be contacted if the --- Band decides that they do not want ownership of the tracks created by the drummer.
The --- Band (entity) is responsible for the unpaid amount. I personally did not receive any services. The --- Band did.

aaaahhhh???

[cgarges]

And if they were his tunes and he wanted to continue to use the recorded tracks, he'd be demanding that you give him the masters, even if the band still existed without him.

The secretary analogy is a bad one because a secretary isn't generally a partner in a business, but a paid employee. Ken Lay still went to court, you know.

Man, this blows.

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC

[KilledByAlbany]

I'm pretty sure that secretary analogy is horseshit from a legal standpoint, or at least won't hold up well under scrutiny if you still have records or receipts and copies of your communications with him over email and what not.

Businesses have a lot of ways to function that keep partners safe from situations like these, enough to make ones head spin when trying to fully understand them. But unless the band in question legally managed to make themselves a Limited Liability Partnership of some sort, you can still hold individuals accountable for the debts of the band.

It would be really nice if there is an (aspiring?) entertainment lawyer among us who might be able to give some specifics as to where the law stops in situations like this. Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

As it stands now, I absolutely see this guys point, in that he doesn't feel that he should be responsible for a situation that he feels he didn't create. It's a really undesirable position to be in. But just because he walked out on them, it doesn't make it your responsibility to talk sense into a bunch of people that you have no legitimate personal connection with, and I think that this is something that you are going to have to really send home to this guy. Because if all yours dealings have been with him, and you have the documentation to show this, he can most likely be held responsible for the debt to you, regardless of the actions of anybody else in his "business".

I wouldn't actually suggest bringing up courts or legality with this guy unless he gets standoffish and refuses to listen to reason, because no matter what, going to court won't be a good look for anybody involved, but definitely save all of your correspondence just in case.

Next time you get one of those feelings about a band, it might not be such a bad idea to make signing a contract part of the process when you collect your deposit. Something that makes each person (undersigned) responsible for payment in full or stated percentage. It could easily be made out to be just as protective to all the band members as it would be to you. It would require you to keep more detailed records on the session than one is normally used to, but in contrast to the headache you are going through now, it might not be so bad.

[orbb]

This is an interesting situation.Does anyone have any solutions?

I just got this email from my contact:

While I was the liaison for the --- band, coordinating activities and so on, the service was provided to the --- band. The --- band is the entity that was to receive service, not me. That would be like asking a secretary for a business to pay for services rendered to the business. It was my understanding that the --- band wanted to continue on with the demo.
Believe me I don't want to stick you, but what is right is right. I will also note that it was the drummer's overage that created the unpaid portion of the bill. As you know, the drummer is also not with the band, but perhaps he should be contacted if the --- Band decides that they do not want ownership of the tracks created by the drummer.
The --- Band (entity) is responsible for the unpaid amount. I personally did not receive any services. The --- Band did.

aaaahhhh???

I'm a lawyer, and here are my two cents:

If the band is a formal entity (a corporation or an LLC), then the liability for your charges lie with that entity, even if one of the members was your contact and served as an agent for the entity. In some states (my state, West Virginia, in particular), you can sue both the agent and the entity.

If they were not an organized entity, then they were either a general partnership or a joint venture. Under either scenario (and in the absence of a formal agreement between them, which it would be highly unusual if they did have one), then EACH member of the partnership is jointly and severally liable for all the charges. It would be up to them to work it out between themselves; you could collect all the charges from one of them, and he would have to get reimbursed by the other members.

I'd sue all of the old members in small claims court. If you want some advice on going further, PM me.