16" floor tom batter head speculation

honkyjonk · Post by **honkyjonk** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 3:36 pm

I recently got a set of set of Gretsch Stop sign era drums w/ a 16" floor tom.

I used to have a 16" Slingerland a long time ago, and w/ both of these drums I've found it rather hard to get a good sound w/ a single-ply remo coated ambassador. (resonant side has the same)

I think the drum had a two ply clear head on it before I replaced it that may have had a bit more meatiness to it if I remember right, but had the plasticky thwack that all clear heads seem to have.

Anyway, I just thought I'd ask out of curiosity if some folks have found that they like a 2 ply batter head on a 16" tom, even while other toms are single ply.

vsr600 · Post by **vsr600** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:12 pm

I like single ply ambassadors (coated on top, clear on bottom) on my Slingerlands (12 and 16 toms). It's just a classic sound. I tune the bottom head fairly tight and the top about finger light (maybe a little more). Sometimes I put a little moon gel near the rim when recording.

roscoenyc · Post by **roscoenyc** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:11 pm

Ambassadors are great if you are changing them regularly.

A coated Emperor is a 2 ply head that gives you more bottom
but still has some snap. Tuning is a little easier. It is a good head
if your OH's are your main sound and you are adding close mics to that
sound. Emperors are durable.

Judas Jetski · Post by **Judas Jetski** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 7:36 pm

It's never a bad idea to keep your batter head thicker than your resonant head. Or at least as thick. I'm not sure about stop sign drums but when I had my roundbadge Gretsch set they were killer sensitive to any adjustments at all. I wound up using Remo Pinstrupes on the top and something pretty heavy (emperors?) on the bottom.

JohnDavisNYC · Post by **JohnDavisNYC** » Mon Jun 25, 2007 6:07 am

change the rubber feet on the floor tom legs to those 'suspension' feet with the little rubber ring... or some sort of well suspended rubber foot... the straight legs coupled with the thin, hard rubber 'booties' really kill the sound of the tom sometimes...

when we were working on some phonograph basics, dave brought his roundbadge (silver sparkle... awesome) and we were having a shit time trying to get a floor tom sound... everything else was awesome... then we picked it up and hit it, and it sounded huge.... put it down again, and it sucked.... picked it up, huge.... put it down.... shit.

so, i pulled the rubber feet off some Sonor tom legs i had lying around and voila, great floor tom sound!

as for heads, they were Aquarian American Vintage.... they are a better fit with someone the older american drums.

john

JASIII · Post by **JASIII** » Mon Jun 25, 2007 1:04 pm

I've found with my 16" Slingerland floor tom ('62), that I need a thin, clear head to get it to sound good. So I use a coated Ambassador on my 12" tom and a 16" clear diplomat for floor batter head. Too thick a batter head and it sounds like a plastic ice cream bucket.

permanent hearing damage · Post by **permanent hearing damage** » Mon Jun 25, 2007 1:12 pm

anyone else notice 16x16 floor toms usually having a weird resonance - like a weird low end surge after the initial attack? it's different on all drums, sure. but i can't remember a 16x16 tom NOT doing that for me. i have a '72 Rogers maple, an early 80s Tama Granstar custom birch, and some older Ludwig rocker kit. all of them do this to some extent. any ideas?

Judas Jetski · Post by **Judas Jetski** » Mon Jun 25, 2007 3:55 pm

Wow... Vintage Drum-O-Rama...

I had a '62 Slingerland set. It was nice. The '58 I have now has Remo Fiberskin 3s on it. Thump, thump. I had hopes that they would give me a more "old-school" sound, but I'm not convinced.

honkyjonk · Post by **honkyjonk** » Tue Jun 26, 2007 9:40 am

I dug around and found the original heads I had for this drum, and they are an ambassador (clear) for the resonant side and a clear pinstripe for the batter.

It sounds much better now. Is a pinstripe double ply? I can't really tell. It looks like there is and extra reinforcement ply on the edge or something.

Anyway, I really am not too into non-coated heads, so it's kind of wierd that this sounds better for me. But the coated head just seemed to have no low end. All ice-cream bucket poing, if that's what you want to call it.

Wierd. I think I'll eventually try a coated diplomat.

Judas Jetski · Post by **Judas Jetski** » Tue Jun 26, 2007 2:24 pm

It's my belief that a pinstripe is a two-ply head. As far as I know, they are not hydraulic. Just two-ply with residual oil from the manufacture process. I have no idea why they always wind up sounding best for me. It makes no sense to me. I cannot explain this. They just do. I've even tried the coated pinstripes, but nope. They just don't do it. There's a couple of things like this that should not make that much of a difference but just do. Nylon tips on the drumsticks sound better to me than wood. Aquarian muffle-rings sound better than Rem-O's or anything like them. Don't know why; makes no sense; true nonetheless.

One thing I will say is that when I stuck a coated snare-head (probably emperor) on my calfskin tack-head 14" Gretsch tom, it sounded fantastic and wonderful. I wish I could get sounds like that on demand. But no, it's just that one drum.

cgarges · Post by **cgarges** » Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:15 am

Andy Smash wrote:It's my belief that a pinstripe is a two-ply head. As far as I know, they are not hydraulic. Just two-ply with residual oil from the manufacture process.

Yep, Pinstripes are two ply, glues together entirely in the outer ring (with more glue holding them together than two-ply Emperors. Contrary to popular belief, here are no drumheads with oil in between the plies except for the Evans Hydraulic series. The sort of rainbow-colored stuff that looks like oil in other two-ply heads is just the visual effect of two layers of mylar rubbing together.

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC

JASIII · Post by **JASIII** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 8:24 am

Man, I put one of those evans hydraulics on my floor tom once and that was completely the wrong direction! Go thin! Thin! Thin!

Funny, I've got a coated ambass on my rack tom (12", it's actually a 63' Leedy that matches the rest of my Slinger 4 piece, except the lugs of course. So if I don't tell anyone, they rarely notice....), and sometimes a drummer will come in and see that coated head on the high tom and you can just see by the look on their face..like 'ugghh I don't want to play on that', expecting a pinstripe or something clear. But that tom with that head just has a cool sound and most guys end up digging it. One guy compared it to the old "Philly Joe" tom sound, which I think is pretty right on.

I really dig vintage drums. Sometimes I think about selling my kit to get something new and decent with precise lugs and perfect bearing edges, but I just can't do it. I'd rather have something unique and make the other guys bring their DW's if they want that sound.

Judas Jetski · Post by **Judas Jetski** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:42 pm

cgarges wrote:
Andy Smash wrote:It's my belief that a pinstripe is a two-ply head. As far as I know, they are not hydraulic. Just two-ply with residual oil from the manufacture process.
Yep, Pinstripes are two ply, glues together entirely in the outer ring (with more glue holding them together than two-ply Emperors. Contrary to popular belief, here are no drumheads with oil in between the plies except for the Evans Hydraulic series. The sort of rainbow-colored stuff that looks like oil in other two-ply heads is just the visual effect of two layers of mylar rubbing together.

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC

Chris, can I quote you on that? (Oh, wait, I just did.) Then can I get it put on a T-shirt? I've had the "hydraulic pinstripe" argument more times that I can count.

Someday when I have loads of cash I'm going to try to get a good Motown-y sound out of one of my sets. Y'know, just swap heads until I get the right sound... someday... someday... (ahh, who am I kidding)

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16" floor tom batter head speculation

16" floor tom batter head speculation

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