Take the plunge for Soundcraft Ghost?

acstctws · Post by **acstctws** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 12:03 am

This is my first post here...I also posted on Gearslutz, so this may look familiar, but anyway....

I'm thinking very seriously about purchasing a Soundcraft Ghost (probably 24 ch. version), as from my research it seems to be a good console that is within my budget. However, I'm not sure that I really need a console right now. At this moment in time, I have no outboard gear, and I record with a Digi002 and Presonus Digimax LT. The preamps on the Soundcraft I'm sure are better than those on the 002, and I would imagine would be comparible to those of the Digimax.

However, I have a few concerns before spending this kind of money on a console.

1) I know the Toft Trident Series ATB is coming soon, and it sounds like it is going to be a killer board.

2) I don't want to put money into equipment that I will outgrow quickly. My setup is fairly small right now, so will the Ghost allow for a good bit of expansion, or would I be better off saving up more money and going for a used Trident of some sort a few years down the road? Does anyone know about what ballpark Trident 60, 70, or 80 series consoles go for?

3) Will mixing on a lower end console like this really offer any improvement over mixing ITB, especially since I will not be using any outboard right now? If not, I think I would probably be better off investing in better pres, mics, and some outboard right now.

I really appreciate any suggestions that anyone has. Thanks!

seaneldon · Post by **seaneldon** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 12:54 am

some things to consider:

your 002 will only do 16 (18 maybe?) channels with a separate D/A converter, and cannot be expanded further. therefore you'd never use 24 channels of whatever console on mixdown, due to the limited inputs of the 002, you wouldn't be able to track the entire console at the same time, either.

a trident 80b or c, depending on condition and number of channels, will sell for anywhere from $18k-40k. 65s are the most awful pieces of garbage ever, with the exception of those lavendar oram boards. 70s are okay.

the ghost is okay. a very good "my first console". quite a step up from something like a mackie, which i believe you WOULD outgrow rather fast.

acstctws · Post by **acstctws** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 1:18 pm

Yeah, right now I'll only be able to record/sum with 16 channels...however, one day I may end up moving to an HD rig, or some other option with more I/Os, and that's why I want to be sure the Ghost will stay up to par as my other equipment improves. Does anyone have any thoughts on how things will sound mixing OTB on the Ghost as compared to ITB with Pro Tools (since I'll still be using mainly plugs for right now)? I may have my 002 upgraded by Black Lion, and invest in 8 more channels of decent converters if I end up getting a console.

FormulaReed · Post by **FormulaReed** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 3:44 pm

I would go for it. Working on a console is a much more enjoyable experience then ITB. I also think that any half decent console sounds better, or at least more unique then Pro Tools. I bet that you will out grow your 002r way before the ghost.

Best luck,

Reed

T-rex · Post by **T-rex** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 7:41 pm

Here's MHO: If you plan on mixing in the box I probably wouldn't take the plunge, instead you could use the cash for really killer AD/DA converters and some sweet pres. You could optimize you signal going into the box and then have better sounds to mix ITB.

With that said, I am a total believer in mixing on a console, even a cheap one over ITB. I am not saying either one is better or any of that argument, but I am saying it is WAY MORE ENJOYABLE to me to mix on a console. It's tactile, you can realy hear very minute adjustments, you can turn your computer monitors completely off and just mix by ear without even looking at a computer screen. Even if you are using all fx in the box, by leaving everything at unity in the box and mixing on a console, I have started getting much better results.

Also you get 24 channels of EQ and pre's not to mention all the ultilitarian things; aux sends for efx and headphone mixes, talkback, the list goes on and on. By the time you buy a Mackie big knob, a few decent outboard eq's and pre's, a computer that cost a million bucks so you can get the latency down to a manageable level for monitoring etc. - you have already paid more than the cost of a used ghost. My 2 cents, good luck!

parlormusic · Post by **parlormusic** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 6:26 am

seaneldon wrote:some things to consider:

your 002 will only do 16 (18 maybe?) channels with a separate D/A converter, and cannot be expanded further. therefore you'd never use 24 channels of whatever console on mixdown, due to the limited inputs of the 002, you wouldn't be able to track the entire console at the same time, either.

a trident 80b or c, depending on condition and number of channels, will sell for anywhere from $18k-40k. 65s are the most awful pieces of garbage ever, with the exception of those lavendar oram boards. 70s are okay.

the ghost is okay. a very good "my first console". quite a step up from something like a mackie, which i believe you WOULD outgrow rather fast.

In situations such as recording drums, live band, choir etc, using those extra channels and routing them to a stereo bus mix can be handy.

joel hamilton · Post by **joel hamilton** » Tue Aug 08, 2006 7:11 am

When I had a 16 track, 2 inch machine I almost always used all the channels on the 32 channel MCI console I had at the time (years ago). One stereo verb return and I was up to 18, a stereo mult of the vocal through two delays... 20, a parallell drum sub in stereo..22, a spring verb returning in stereo..24, a tape echo: 25, a single delay for something else: 26. An SPX 90 running "symphonic" 28, a mono return for a center image comp... 29... input channels for overdubs right up to the end : 30-31-32.

You get the point.

A 24 channel console will get used up quickly. The ghost is a suprisingly good console. I worked on one for a while, and some of the mixes kind of freak me out. They really are good, especially for the money. The EQ is quite useable, buss architecture is cool (inserts for all the groups, and "B"mix)... you can do a lot with the routing. It is actually kind of nice to have the mute automation as well. lockk that to your DAW (or tape with a midi timepiece) and have some way to get rid of the hissing compressor noise in the long guitar break....

acstctws · Post by **acstctws** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 2:56 pm

I ended up not getting the original Ghost I was looking at. However, I have now found a 32 channel Ghost LE with meterbridge and stand. It is about 7 or 8 years old, and unfortunately has the older grey power supply. However, I can get the thing for about $2300 including shipping and everything. Is this worth it?

I'm Painting Again · Post by **I'm Painting Again** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:33 pm

Yeah totally if it helps you get your job done better and faster..

lacquer_monkey · Post by **lacquer_monkey** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 9:35 pm

The only problem with an older ghost is that they are extremely unfriendly to work on if anything should go wrong. For any older consoles, the first thing to do is look at the top surface. If it is a single plane and a channel goes down you have to down the whole board to repair it. Don't get me wrong, I like Ghosts when they are working. I just hate working on them. If you can't do your own maintenance a Ghost will cost you a lot if it needs repair and you will be out of commission 'til it is fixed. Modular or semi-modular (4 or 8 channel buckets) allow you to operate while the dead chunk is being repaired.

jd

joel hamilton · Post by **joel hamilton** » Thu Sep 07, 2006 7:26 am

lacquer_monkey wrote:The only problem with an older ghost is that they are extremely unfriendly to work on if anything should go wrong. For any older consoles, the first thing to do is look at the top surface. If it is a single plane and a channel goes down you have to down the whole board to repair it. Don't get me wrong, I like Ghosts when they are working. I just hate working on them. If you can't do your own maintenance a Ghost will cost you a lot if it needs repair and you will be out of commission 'til it is fixed. Modular or semi-modular (4 or 8 channel buckets) allow you to operate while the dead chunk is being repaired.

jd

True that the ghost is a pita when it comes to getting inside... the two giant PCB sandwaich is a PITA big time, but luckily you only need to replace the CRM pot like every 2 months...

For real, though the CRM pot is the only thing that seems to get scratchy on any of them I have ever used, or anyone I know that has one. Aside from that, they are pretty rock solid consoles.

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Take the plunge for Soundcraft Ghost?

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