EQing mono overhead - where to start?

[Rolsen]

I've got 4 tracks of drums, accomplished like so:

OH: SP C-1 > Pro Channel, split 'parallel compression' style to track 1 (uncompressed) and track 2 (compressed)

Snare: Audix I-5 > Meek 3Q w/ mild compression

Kick: Audix D6 > SP VTB-1

First time recording drums, but I was shocked at how much I liked this setup. I suspect that there are some frequencies eating up headroom, or just waiting to cause some serious muddiness once everything else comes in. With the mono OH picking up a really balanced picture of the whole kit, are there some frequency 'trouble spots' that I should recognize as a starting point? A lot of literature/posts/etc out there references applying (or subtracting) eq to individual drums rather than a whole kit.

BTW, the long threads awhile back regarding parallel compression were invaluable - my drum mix would be nowhere near where it is now without that applied to my OH.

[trodden]

what are the other instruments and what kind of stuff are they doing? How does you room sound and how does that reflect with what the mic's are picking up?

my room sucks so i do some carving of the OH. I also record bands with hella low end in the bass(es) and many guitars... so... i usually low cut some, usually suck out some muddy mids, and depending on what the other drum and room mics are doing, do something up above... it all depends.., it would be fun to do a style of music some time where i don't have to manipulate the drums so much to make them fit within the mix.. but so it goes with metal/hardcore doomy stuff, not that its a concrete rule...,

[Rolsen]

The room is a 11' x 12' spare bedroom, 8' ceilings with 9 broadband/basstrap absorbers on walls, corners and wall-ceilings. Instrumentation will be conventional - jazz bass recorded direct and through small guitar amp, jazzmaster and les paul through marshall and blues jr with mild-medium overdriven tones, a keyboard here and there. After hearing a rough mix of the drums with scratchtracks, I didn't hear any major conflicts, but I figure there's headroom to be had if I, say, cut some low-mids or something. I just don't have the experience behind me to confidently start chiseling, thus I'm looking for the cheater tips!

[drumsound]

EQ settings are not matter of course. The apply to specific situations. There are many factors to the decision. These include (but are not limited to) arrangement of the track, instrumentation, key tempo, roll of each instrument/voice in the track, desired vibe, style, artistic vision, even desired audience.

I will say, for the unpteenth million time, don't EQ in SOLO. Make you EQ decisions in the context of the mix. That is how they will be heard in the "real world."

Good Luck and Have Fun!

[MoreSpaceEcho]

After hearing a rough mix of the drums with scratchtracks, I didn't hear any major conflicts, but I figure there's headroom to be had if I, say, cut some low-mids or something.

don't eq for 'headroom'. eq if it sounds bad. if it sounds good, leave it alone.

[Dave Stanley]

EQ settings are not matter of course. The apply to specific situations. There are many factors to the decision. These include (but are not limited to) arrangement of the track, instrumentation, key tempo, roll of each instrument/voice in the track, desired vibe, style, artistic vision, even desired audience.

Tony can you please elborate on "desired audience?" It never occured to me. Just making things sound good to my ears was my only consideration.

[Roboburger]

phase flipping an overhead can do interesting things, too. Some of them very damaging, sure- but some can really be good.

[gevermil]

I notice a big difference in phase when using just 2 mics on the kit
When i flip phase the kick will sound big and the snare /toms sound smaller
and vice versa , The placement with 2 mics seems to be a complicated affair
g

[JohnDavisNYC]

move the mic

j

[Recycled_Brains]

i don't understand the "EQ for headroom" idea. i don't think subtracting from a certain frequency range is going to change your overrall headroom on your master fader in any significant way. if you want more headroom, track at lower levels. are you tracking ITB or to tape?

only eq if you need it. start with balancing the volumes of the instruments, and try some panning stuff, then worry about EQ if somethings not working for you. if it's jazz, i'd be more inclined to low-pass the OH personally. but i hate bright stuff.

don't carve out frequencies because you think you should, only if you think you must. if it sounds cool as is, then you're work is done.

have fun!

-ryan

[Kasey]

move the mic

j

seconded... I've been using mono overheads much more recently, and I've learned a lot more about mic placement because of it. It's tricky, but its the only way.

[Rolsen]

Thanks guys

When I was thinking about 'eq'ing for headroom,' I shouldn've clarified where I was coming from. I was thinking of something akin to the idea of a high-pass filter on a guitar - you don't need much below 80 hz, and you may not notice that cut until you hear things together. I was just wondering if these 'less-useful' frequencies reside in a common drum OH sound. I'm not sure, with my monitoring situation, I could hear the difference if I slashed everything below 40 hz. But maybe that would de-muck the future mix, if it needed de-mucking? Anyhow, 'headroom' was the wrong word for me to use.

[logancircle]

The trick (one of many) is, if you're using a mono overhead because you're limited in the number of tracks you can record, first make that OH track sound like a full kit by itself. When you can only record drums with one mic, you figure out how to make that one mic act as a combination OH, room, kick, snare, toms mic by moving the mic, then add close mics as needed. I find I often don't need a "well-miked" kit.

[river]

don't understand the "EQ for headroom" idea. i don't think subtracting from a certain frequency range is going to change your overrall headroom on your master fader in any significant way.

Boosting or cutting a frequency with EQ is a gain stage. When you add up a bunch of tracks with a bunch of boosted frequencies, you've lost a bunch of headroom. If you use subtractive EQ techniques, you're preserving headroom. I always use a highpass at 30Hz on anything with lots of bass information, since digital bandwidth goes down to 5Hz and nobody's hearing that stuff, but it's using up bucketfuls of headroom.

As for the original topic, why not clone the original OH track, do parallel comp on that as well, and EQ the 1st set for lows & low mids, the 2nd set for upper mids & highs?

[drumsound]

EQ settings are not matter of course. The apply to specific situations. There are many factors to the decision. These include (but are not limited to) arrangement of the track, instrumentation, key tempo, roll of each instrument/voice in the track, desired vibe, style, artistic vision, even desired audience.

Tony can you please elborate on "desired audience?" It never occured to me. Just making things sound good to my ears was my only consideration.

"Desired audience" is just what it sounds like. Who's going to listen to this record and why? Are you trying to get gigs at a club? If so may going crazy with effects and "out there" production tricks isn't smart. If you have an established audience that expects you to take you songs and twist and turn them (i.e Wilco, Flaming Lips etc) and you deliver a straight up "$ guys playing the songs" you might loos some of your base. The end listener is thought of and catered to more on some porjects and music types (Britney, etc) and less on others (Built to Spill, Grandaddy).