Give us back that firewire port....

analogcabin · Post by **analogcabin** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 8:41 am

Write Apple:

http://www.apple.com/feedback/macbook.html

Jeff White · Post by **Jeff White** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 8:56 am

I am really really really unhappy with Apple for dropping Firewire on the MacBooks. Seems like the focus groups that they put together to figure out what to keep and what to drop and what to add didn't include any professionals. I suppose that's what the "Pro" in MacBook Pro means. It seems that just when the less expensive laptops got up there in speed, firewire was dropped in order to make all of the audio and video folks have to pony-up the extra cash.

Regarding FW800 only on the new 15" MacBook Pros... there is also a card slot which you can add a second firewire bus. What I do on my Powerbook is run the drive off of the card and the interface off of the internal fw bus. You can do this vice-versa. Having a card is a necessity with a MacBook Pro or Powerbook imho. However, what I am wondering is if the fw port is going to give folks problems with their audio interfaces. I've heard that folks are having problems out there, something to do with apple switching something FW chipsets? Again, I've heard, not experienced.

Then there is this adapter for the daisy-chain gang: http://store1.sonnettech.com/product_in ... ucts_id=87

I feel like the sky is falling every time that Apple releases a new computer since the MacBook Air came out (with the exception of the Mac Pro... well... price). I hate that feeling.

Jeff

analogcabin · Post by **analogcabin** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 9:14 am

I feel what you are saying.
I have a feeling a lot of folks aren't buying rev. A Macbooks in the hopes they'll wake up and put back the firewire ports.

I mean target disk mode, ext. HD's, DV cameras, even the Apple only Apogee Duet.... shows a Macbook in their ad. Now it's obsolete with the new hardware.

I hope lots of folks write a quick note..... who knows?

the finger genius · Post by **the finger genius** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 12:09 pm

done, and done. and i mean done.

angry letters happen to be my specialty.

lysander · Post by **lysander** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 12:54 pm

I think the writing's on the wall for FW-400 -- ever since the iPods switched to USB I've had that feeling.

The FW-400 connector is a problem -- it's too easy to plug it in the wrong and fry the port. And I never found FW to be as reliably hot-swappable as advertised. It's a pretty temperamental interface spec.

Unfortunately, my two interfaces are FW. I'll miss the simplicity of target mode, too.

Wilkesin · Post by **Wilkesin** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 8:48 pm

ipressrecord wrote:I suppose that's what the "Pro" in MacBook Pro means.

Ha, the pro in "pro-sumer" interfaces just got really emphasized! As in, Macbook Pro.

Sometimes it feels good to be a couple years behind the digerati's curve.

rwc · Post by **rwc** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 10:45 pm

I am not surprised.

One of the ONLY 1K laptops to lack both expresscard and PCMCIA.

I NEVER considered it a real laptop. More like fischer price's my first notebook.

I know I'm gonna get shot at for this but I never considered firewire interfaces really pro. PCI, and PCI express stuff to me has lways been truly rock solid. it's not the lack of firewire that kills me as much as the lack of PCMCIA, or expresscard, that every other fucking laptop in that price range has.

tubetapexfmr · Post by **tubetapexfmr** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:28 pm

Does anyone remember when the first Macbook Pros came out? They lacked FW800 like the old Powerbooks had and pros bitched about it so apple put it back with rev. B. Apple said that you could just add an expresscard to put FW 800 back in there, but still people wanted it built in so they got their wish.

There has been a HUGE amount of flak that Apple has taken over this removal of firewire completely that I am sure it will show up in rev B of the new Macbooks. It is shitty of them to have pushed this technology for years only now to dump it. If it is for the sake of ports then they could implement firewire over ethernet which is an existing but unreleased technology they have developed. then you would just need an adapter.

I don't really care what interface they use for ipods, though I do miss the target disk mode on there, but for a MAC computer it has to have firewire! If it is a matter of differentiating the consumer and pro laptop then why don't they break out the FW1600/3200 protocol which is ready to go. I don't think they fully understand how there is an entire professional segment dedicated to firewire in both interfaces, cameras and drives that will just disappear if they start dumping firewire from their computers.

Everyone who reads this should send a message of disgust to apple for not ONLY dropping firewire, but for drpping matte screens as well. I fsucking hate that glossy bullsh*t!

JGriffin · Post by **JGriffin** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:47 pm

lysander wrote:I think the writing's on the wall for FW-400 -- ever since the iPods switched to USB I've had that feeling.

The FW-400 connector is a problem -- it's too easy to plug it in the wrong and fry the port. And I never found FW to be as reliably hot-swappable as advertised. It's a pretty temperamental interface spec.

Unfortunately, my two interfaces are FW. I'll miss the simplicity of target mode, too.

But USB is limited to 2 tracks of audio if I'm not mistaken. At least, I've never seen a 4-channel USB interface...(not like I look every day, but still).

tubetapexfmr · Post by **tubetapexfmr** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:39 pm

But USB is limited to 2 tracks of audio if I'm not mistaken. At least, I've never seen a 4-channel USB interface...(not like I look every day, but still).

This is true with USB 1.1, but there are plenty of USB 2.0 devices out there with up to 16 tracks if I'm not mistaken. The problem is I have never been happy with a USB Audio device ever. Having to use a USB external hard drive only compounds matters. USB was not designed for audio and there are a lot of technical reasons why it should not be relied on for mission critical applications like moving multiple streams of high res audio. I'm sure a better expert could flesh out the reasoning behind this.

My main concern is I waited nearly a year to get the newly designed Macbook for location recording and I already have a large investment in all kinds of FW 400 gear. I use Macs exclusively and figured since it was THEIR technology that they would continue to support it on all their machines. I figured worst case scenario they switch over to the FW 800/1600/3200 port in time as it is a better physical design, but dropping it completely? It is the worst mistake they have made since firing Steve Jobs in the 80s, especially if it is the shape of things to come.

lysander · Post by **lysander** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:28 pm

Wikipedia says that UB 3 should be available next year, and its specs will be closer to FW-800. It should be fine for audio, with full duplex.

Dropping FW from the MacBook is a move I would have expected from the old Apple, not the one that's been making amazing market share inroads in the past few years.

The white MacBook was one of the best values Apple has ever offered, and that's why it was so popular. Crippling it was a bonehead move.

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:46 pm

I've had them since the plus. I expected a move like this. They've done it multiple times over the years. HOWEVER, the macbook with FW is one heck of a big step away from the plus and X is a big step away from system 5 or 6.
Firewire came in during the G3 laptops, I think the pismo was first. The display ram was too low for anything past OSX 1 on anything without a firewire port. There were hacks that worked and "unsupported" doesn't mean it won't work on a mac, but, with IBM and Microsoft out of the way, they can become the lowest common denominator now.

tubetapexfmr · Post by **tubetapexfmr** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:24 pm

I was looking at a teardown of the New Macbook and they have added a ... get this... a fucking subwoofer! Yeah, that's what we need, a 3/4" wide subwoofer! I guess THAT is why there is no room for a firewire port! Sheesh, Apple has bowed down to the consumer cocksuckers out there who want glossy bullshit and could give a fuck about firewire. These new laptops literally are big shiny turds! So, tell me now, who makes the best PC laptop with firewire that makes a good Hackintosh? I can't beleive I am saying that but Apple has dumped the Pro users big time with this update and I have no other choice:

-Cheap ass 6-bit dithered glossy screens. This totally fucks graphic and video people.
-No firewire 400. This totally fucks audio people.
-STILL has a 32-bit architecture. This fucks those who need a 64-bit portable or folks who want more than 4 GB of RAM.
-They DON'T include a display port adapter with their $2000 laptop! Greedy fucks!

Folks, I love OS X and working with audio on it, but I think I may be done with new Apple hardware! Time to geek out with linux and Ardour.

RoyMatthews · Post by **RoyMatthews** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:33 pm

To be honest, the Macbook isn't their "Pro" line. 90% of the people who get a MacBook won't miss the FW port.

Don't get me wrong I wish it were there but for what it's designed to do I won't miss it.

chris harris · Post by **chris harris** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:41 pm

RoyMatthews wrote:To be honest, the Macbook isn't their "Pro" line. 90% of the people who get a MacBook won't miss the FW port.

Capturing video from a DV camera and editing something in iMovie to throw on YouTube isn't exactly a "Pro" application.

That's the biggest thing. Sure, comparatively few people use firewire audio interfaces. But, lots of people use video cameras for fun.

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Give us back that firewire port....

Give us back that firewire port....

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