Bari Sax recording technique

[AstroSounds]

Thanks for all the input everyone. I especially appreciate the people who suggested something that wouldn't cost me over $250 in new mics. I'm a grad student and money is severely limited.

However, I did use this as an excuse to grab a Cascade Fathead since several people noted that ribbons sound great. I'll probably point the Fathead, my Bluebird and an EV RE-10 all at the left pinky a few feet back and see which mic (or combination) sounds best.

Thanks again.

[Jay Reynolds]

Sounds like you've got a plan. But, since I said i would, here's my ubertar ribbon vs SM57 bari sax shootout. I had the ribbon a little closer (about a foot) than the 57 (a foot and a half).
57
Ribbon

[drumsound]

<- Trying hard to not make a snarky comment about a know bari player's recording.

[AstroSounds]

Hey everyone,

I ended up going with the Fathead on the bari.
Two reasons:
1. I only have 2 LDCs, one went on the tenor player and the other was set in omni as a distant mic (turns out the distant mic wasn't that useful)
2. I knew I could angle the null point on the ribbon to reduce bleed from the tenor standing right next to the bari player.

Anyway, after a couple positions there was definitely one that popped:
1' in front of bell
microphone center 1-2" above players left hand
angled down pointing at players left pinky - so on axis with the hand not the bell

So basically it's a little higher than I do on tenor/alto, angled down and of course a ribbon not a LDC. The difference between this new position and my standard position resulted in more air/breath and a bit more keys sound (which I like). It didn't sound as canned and stale. The player definitely loved it when I put the mic there.

So that's how it's going to go for the rest of these sessions.
Thanks for the input TOMB!

[Jay Reynolds]

<- Trying hard to not make a snarky comment about a know bari player's recording.

I didn't think it was that bad. There's some key noise in there, but you'd never hear it in context.

Or are you talking smack about Gerry Mulligan?

[Marc Alan Goodman]

Hey everyone,

I ended up going with the Fathead on the bari.
Two reasons:
1. I only have 2 LDCs, one went on the tenor player and the other was set in omni as a distant mic (turns out the distant mic wasn't that useful)
2. I knew I could angle the null point on the ribbon to reduce bleed from the tenor standing right next to the bari player.

Anyway, after a couple positions there was definitely one that popped:
1' in front of bell
microphone center 1-2" above players left hand
angled down pointing at players left pinky - so on axis with the hand not the bell

So basically it's a little higher than I do on tenor/alto, angled down and of course a ribbon not a LDC. The difference between this new position and my standard position resulted in more air/breath and a bit more keys sound (which I like). It didn't sound as canned and stale. The player definitely loved it when I put the mic there.

So that's how it's going to go for the rest of these sessions.
Thanks for the input TOMB!

Ha. i finally caught this thread and that's pretty much exactly what I was going to recommend. Of course it changes from song to song but that's about what I end up doing 90% of the time.

[drumsound]

<- Trying hard to not make a snarky comment about a know bari player's recording.

I didn't think it was that bad. There's some key noise in there, but you'd never hear it in context.

Or are you talking smack about Gerry Mulligan?

I'd never talk smack about Jerry Mulligan.

[Winstontaneous]

I've had very good luck recording bari sax with an AT 4060 large diaphram tube mic. I've done a bunch of jazz records with Ken Vandermark using this mic on all his saxes. We try to keep it back a foot or two.

bob weston

Just curious, is Ken V still the hardest-working man in Chi-town showbiz? When I lived in Chicago in the 90s he played out pretty much every night--literally. Amazing musician, tenacious to boot.

[drumsound]

It depends on what sound you're going for. If you're tracking something where the bari is going to be front and center (small group jazz, for instance), I'd go with the LDC off-axis. If it's going into a mix with a lot of other elements, those dynamics could be fine. If it's a complex mix and there aren't any other low frequency instruments, maybe go with the LDC.

Ribbons sound good. In fact, on the last bari session I did, I used one of ubertar's "Cereal Box" ribbons and it sounded great. The majority of the bari is in the last 1/3 of the song (as well as the alto I record through the same mic).
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2731144/Birds2.aif

.

Cool music!

[Jay Reynolds]

Cool music!

Molto grazie!

[saxrmc]

I've used an AKG C 414 B XLS on my tenor and bari saxes and have to say I like the sound quite a bit. Know this is out of your price range but figured good to know as an option for when you do have more money.

Here is a sample I did with a whole section recorded on that mic. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kmBphaTzAE
The section is in the left speaker but you can hear a separated bari in the right speaker and a separated tenor in the left speaker.

I have no idea what I did with angling the mic. :\

[junomat]

I recently recorded Ellery Eskelin and used a 421 with excellent results.

Some people say they sound nasal on sax, however I think it depends on the player.