need advice on using new drummer

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mn412
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need advice on using new drummer

Post by mn412 » Fri Feb 24, 2006 11:30 am

The deal is that i'll be recording some songs for a guy that has no band. The material isn't amazing. I also have to put a band together for him. There is a really great drummer that I know of (talked to him once for thirty seconds at a show) and would love to use in the future as well. Should I wait till there is a really cool project to try and get him or use him for this stuff. The drummer is a real pro and the tunes are definitly below him so I don't even know if I should call him on the other hand the worst that could happen is he could say no. Any advice would definitly help

Thanks

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;ivlunsdystf
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Post by ;ivlunsdystf » Fri Feb 24, 2006 11:41 am

If he'll do it for what the guy wants to pay him, good deal. I don't see the sense in 'saving' him for a better project. What are you going to do, find a cruddy drummer instead whose playing will just lead to a cruddier result which will make you look like a cruddy recordist?

I have a big box of demo tapes given to me by my cousin, the ex-girlfriend of a great local drummer who did that kind of stuff all the time to pay the bills. He was good enough that he could listen to a demo once on the way to the session and then go in and play the stuff well. Everybody won: He made money, the "artists" got his drumming, and I ended up with dozens of bizarre tapes that he discarded after hearing them once in his car.

Give your client the best possible 'tools' (in this case, a good drummer) and he's way more likely to be happy with the outcome. He can pay the good drummer himself. Win win.

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Post by cgarges » Fri Feb 24, 2006 12:16 pm

Amen, Tater!

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Post by drumsound » Sat Feb 25, 2006 1:44 am

Yep, Tater hit the nail on the head!

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Post by Professor » Sat Feb 25, 2006 3:01 am

Don't sound like you're gushing over him, but just come right out and say that you think the gig is beneath his skills, but you'd rather give him the work if he's interested and you think the 'artist' could benefit from the good drumming.
Blowing a little sunshine up the guys ass will make him feel good, and he'll want to do more work with you later - even if he can't make it or won't take the price on this one.

-Jeremy

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Post by soundguy » Sun Feb 26, 2006 3:01 pm

If the drummer is a professional musician (ie, pays the bills playing drums) and you have a sufficient budget to hire him, I would absolutely try to hire the guy regardless of how inane the material is. I woudl EXPECIALLY do this if I wanted to work with the guy on something cool. Call him up, say, hey, I got this gig, its pretty cakey stuff, here's the rate, if you are available annd could use the work, would love to have you. If the guy is half cool and the session goes ok, he'll probablybe psyched you hooked him up with a gig and it can serve as the ice breaker for the "cool" session you are anticipating in the future.

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Post by ;ivlunsdystf » Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:06 pm

I would recommend that you stop short of specifically dissing the guy's material when you describe it to the drummer. Just give him the facts. It's nice (though not always practicable) to have a reputation as a good stand-up professional guy who doesn't bust on his clients. The drummer will figure out for himself what he thinks of the material while he's playing the parts and deciding what to do with the paycheck.

Or, maybe the drummer will turn out to be the old college roommate of the songwriter and they're actually old pals, in which case you'd REALLY have a foot in the mouth.

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Post by lyman » Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:37 pm

soundguy wrote:If the drummer is a professional musician (ie, pays the bills playing drums) and you have a sufficient budget to hire him, I would absolutely try to hire the guy regardless of how inane the material is. I woudl EXPECIALLY do this if I wanted to work with the guy on something cool. Call him up, say, hey, I got this gig, its pretty cakey stuff, here's the rate, if you are available annd could use the work, would love to have you. If the guy is half cool and the session goes ok, he'll probablybe psyched you hooked him up with a gig and it can serve as the ice breaker for the "cool" session you are anticipating in the future.

dave
this is good advice.

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Post by stinkpot » Tue Feb 28, 2006 4:42 pm

If the drummer agrees to play on the demo, it'll only make it better, him happier and possibly encourage him to be a repeat client.

Like has already been said, everyone would win. Especially you, because you're throwing work to a talented musician you can use in the future, and probably getting more business - possibly from both and their friends.

Go for it and be professional to both.

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Post by NewAndImprov » Sat Mar 04, 2006 1:06 pm

I just did something similar, I got the drummer in my band (who kicks ass in a most beautiful way) to come in and play on a pop session. The material was really easy, we did 6 songs in one day, of which he had only heard 3 before arriving at the session. Plus, he was overdubbing the kit to pre-existing tracks, done to a click or drum loop. He came in, played great, sounded great, impressed the clients, got his check and everybody left happy. For me, this was the point where the project started sounding like a record and not a bunch of demos. Had we gotten a less cool drummer, we might have saved some $, but the tracks wouldn't be cool.

Another thing to remember is that one of the big differences between a mediocre and a great drummer is that a great drummer can balance his kit as he plays. This drummer hits the kick and snare with a lot of power and consistancy, and pulls back on the cymbals. As a result, he's easier to record, and the tracks just sound good without a lot of mixing. I was using a Shinybox 23 as a room mic about 7 feet in front of the kit and about even with the top of the kick drum, and we may use that as the only drum channel on one tune, it sounded so good. So having a great drummer may end up saving you $ in the end, because you don't have to spend as much time micing the kit and mixing it later. I just used 2 kick mics (D112 in the hole, C3000 out front), a 57 on the snare top, M260 on snare shell, a pair of Shure KSM 32's in the Glyn Johns setup, and the shinybox room mic, had set up and gotten a sound within an hour. And the tracks sound great.

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Post by jmoose » Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:45 pm

Yeah, if the "pro" guy really IS a pro cat then he won't care as long as he's gettin' paid. If it REALLY sucks then 'yuk it up with him but DON'T let the songwriter guy catch 'ya. Heavens to Mergatroid if he does LMAO

Enjoy the hang while he's there, that's what this 'thing' is all about IMO. The fact that we can get paid for this is great but don't forget how much FUN it can be either. Dig it for what it is & then hope that the next time you call him it's for a better project...or maybe he'll call you.

Imagine that.

Anyway I always dig working with great players because it makes ME look good! The last time I worked with a "ringer" I walked away with the knowledge of a great movie & an even BETTER Courtney Love joke. The guy was on the road with her in Europe, mid/late 90's...man did he ever have some stories...but anyway...

Whuz' the difference between Courtney Love & Wayne Gretzky?

Gretzky takes a shower after three periods.

Thank you folks, try the veal!
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