Tips for tinny guitars

[losthighway]

Hi all, I'm mixing an album (luckily unattended sessions) for a group. When we recorded I was not in love with the guitar sound: Fender Texas Tele into a usually overdriven Mesa combo. Now that we're mixing I'm kicking myself for not bringing out another amp, or taking a DI.

The overdriven sound is, hmm... fizzy. If that makes sense. It has this terrible combination of being brittle, but also sounding kind of smeary and unfocused. I'm assuming part of it was the guitarist strumming very hard near the bridge.

Of course I have tried EQ, and some level of EQ will be necessary, but I haven't found the setting yet. So far I've totally been able to darken the sound but there is still a missing clarity. It seems like part of it is the gain structure of the amp. It's like I'm trying to get EQ to change the way the guitar hits the amp, and of course that doesn't work.

I was wondering if anyone had any other more innovative solutions. I'm going to try eq -> tube compressor and see if that's better or worse.

I can't recall ever having this kind of trouble mixing an electric guitar track. Any bright (no pun intended) ideas are greatly appreciated.
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[Nick Sevilla]

Ah, the morning is smiling. Let's dissect this, shall we?

"Hi all, I'm mixing an album (luckily unattended sessions) for a group."

Might be a good thing, but probably not for this one problem. How often are you communicating with the band?

"When we recorded I was not in love with the guitar sound: Fender Texas Tele into a usually overdriven Mesa combo."

And what exactly made you just plow ahead with the session, without sorting out that sound right then and there? Other than the usual "low budget, no time" scenario?
Because let me tell you, spending 10 minutes tweaking the sound source will save you entire days of mix hell. And THAT is the cheap way of going about fixing a problem, not what is happening now.

"Now that we're mixing I'm kicking myself for not bringing out another amp, or taking a DI."

Keep on kicking' ... "fix it in the mix" is a biatch, ain't it? It's ok, I usually am never "allowed" to get near the recording sessions, because the bands "think" it will be cheaper this way. Right. Then during the mix everyone says I should have been there. Strange how that works, isn't it?

"The overdriven sound is, hmm... fizzy. If that makes sense. It has this terrible combination of being brittle, but also sounding kind of smeary and unfocused. I'm assuming part of it was the guitarist strumming very hard near the bridge."

Assuming. Nope, don't do it. You have what you have, and unless you re-record it, you'll have to spend a lot of time pulling your hair/teeth to get something YOU like.
With that said, what does the BAND think of the guitar sound? If they like it as is, you're DONE.

"Of course I have tried EQ, and some level of EQ will be necessary, but I haven't found the setting yet. So far I've totally been able to darken the sound but there is still a missing clarity. It seems like part of it is the gain structure of the amp. It's like I'm trying to get EQ to change the way the guitar hits the amp, and of course that doesn't work."

You're over thinking this one. Instead of "darkening", which I am guessing is removing top end, try to BOOST the low end.

"I was wondering if anyone had any other more innovative solutions. I'm going to try eq -> tube compressor and see if that's better or worse."

Yes. I have the perfect idea. TALK to the band about the guitar sound. Don't spend hours / days tweaking, and then present it to the band for them to tear it down.

"I can't recall ever having this kind of trouble mixing an electric guitar track. Any bright (no pun intended) ideas are greatly appreciated."

Well, live and learn. I get multi tracks into my mix studio all the time, and usually there is always ONE instrument that sucks. I usually tell the artist asap my feelings on said instrument, to gauge what the artist thinks of the sound. And I always involve the artist when it comes to more radical fixes to their music.
You might get lucky and get another recording which sounds better to all involved, especially the band.

Cheers
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[losthighway]

[mwerden]

Try a deesser or some kind of multiband comp. You can also EQ out the badness and then remake better content in that frequency range using some kind of harmonic distortion or the like. Or darken it up and put some bright ambience on it - reamp through a bright room, add bright slap delay, etc.

Nick's point about adding rather than subtracting is also good. Thicken it up with tape, parallel compression, reamping, whatever.

A million things to try.
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[drumsound]

[drumsound]

[vvv]

Consider re-amping.

A re-amp'd track might or might not sound good by itself, or you mebbe could use it under the original track to beef it up. (Be aware of alignment on mix-down.)
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[Snarl 12/8]

Riffing on what MWerden said. Try way over eq'ing down the high end (like remove everything but the fundamentals) and then reconstitute the high-end harmonics with a distortion you do like. You might have to make several copies of the track to isolate different fundamental frequencies.
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Carl Keil

[chris harris]

If you've got time to experiment, some drastic EQ of the high end, as suggested, might also be cool to try on a signal pre-reamping.
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[Dakota]

Yes and yes to all above. De-esser. Reamp it again. Tape! First thing I'd try: run through tube echoplex or equivalent, 100% wet, no feedback. Adjust gain driving into it. Gets the tube and tape and tone thing all in one go.