How many square feet do I need for commercial studio?

[fvrwlf]

Looking to move my studio out of my basement and into a legit commercial space. About how many square feet would you recommend for the live room and control room? Thanks

[fvrwlf]

I should note I will mainly be recording local rock bands on a small budget.

[The Scum]

Some quick pragmatic numbers:

A small 2-car garage is about 20x20. A band can comfortably set up in that sort of room. So 400 SF to start.

And a modest control room could be about half that. Add 200 SF.

That's 600 SF.

But you haven't accounted for any other space, like storage, bathroom, soundlocks, or even the thickness of the wall between the rooms.

Also bear in mind that commercial real estate numbers aren't always accurate. My space was measured externally, and includes a shared area with breaker panels in the total SF number.

I might aim for higher ceilings first, and exact footage second.
_________________
"What fer?"
"Cat fur, to make kitten britches."

[Bro Shark]

42

[chris harris]

My space is currently 2000 sq. ft. It's approx. 800 sq. ft. for the tracking room, 500 sq. ft. for the Control room/Lounge area. And, the rest for Restroom, 2 storage spaces, and 2 small iso rooms/closets.

My studio takes only 1/2 of a 4000 sq. ft. building. I intend to purchase the entire building in the spring. My original intention was to expand and make the studio much larger at that time. But, after using this space for a year and a half, I'm quite happy with the size and sound of the studio as is. So, now the plan is that when I purchase the building, the other half will get a purpose-built mastering room and a small "live" music area with a stage and P.A. for small local shows and for my band and others to have a stage to use to put together their live show/production stuff.
_________________
Studio - http://www.hookechosound.com
Label - http://www.wearenicepeople.com
Band - http://www.depthandcurrent.com
Twitter - http://www.twitter.com/HoodEchoSound

[MoreSpaceEcho]

[Bro Shark]

There are studios going out of business every day. You might wanna look into moving into an existing, built space. And then be prepared to kiss your life, credit and savings away.

[Gregg Juke]

I was going to say 2,000 too (that's about what our last couple of spaces have been). But 42 sounds nice, from a cooling and heating perspective.

Chris, your idea for the building is awesome; hope it all works out.

As far as MSE's control room comment, I can lend it some credence, as our control room in our new place is smaller than our old (small) control room, and it's kind of cozy to work in alone, ok to work in with two, and difficult to listen to mixes in with 3, 4 or more (actually almost impossible with more than 4). But that's why we have playback speakers in the tracking room with the couch.

Aside from Bro Shark's facetiousness in his jocularity and spontaneously dismal but comedic demeanor, there is some merit there, in that the economic downturn has been our friend in the studio world (the opposite in the band world, as my group recently fell out from under me due to the lack of decent paying live work in the last several years). But the last two spaces we rented for studios, each better than the last, have been surprisingly and embarassingly cheap. There is a LOT of real estate that is getting under-utilized right now, so look around and don't be too shy to ask for prices, and if they're negotiable.

GJ

[Bro Shark]

Gregg, thanks for noticing. I'm honored.

I think if one is willing to put 15-20 years into studio ownership without any significant return during that time, knowing at some point that bankruptcy will occur, and stomach the associated credit rape, one can keep a commercial studio running, and possibly even emerge sane and at a place where family members still talk to him/her.

Never done it myself (I'm a day-job slacker. Lazy to the core) but I've seen it firsthand and I know it can be a slog.

42.

ps. It's been said here a million times but small/boxy control rooms suck, if the total square footage isn't huge. Often better to go one-room in those cases.

[MoreSpaceEcho]

yeah definitely try and negotiate the rent, or at least see if they'll give you a few months free while you're building it out.

if you're moving to a shared building, be very conscious of who your neighbors are....the office underneath you is not gonna be too psyched with rock bands playing all day, and you're not gonna be too psyched about the woodworking shop next door. be wary of restaurants and their big noisy exhaust fans.

sorry if that's stating the obvious!

gregg (or anyone), how did you find your spaces, did you go through a realtor? craigslist? driving around looking at buildings? my neighborhood is going the way of the yuppie, my days here have to be numbered...the idea of finding/building a new space is exciting, but i've been here for 12 years, so the thought of moving is....ugh i can't even think about it.
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www.oldcolonymastering.com

[Gregg Juke]

Hey Space,

I was convinced a couple of years ago that there _had_ to be some real estate that a cheap, low rent musician could afford for a real space to track drums in and cool stuff like that. I'd been saving gear for years, and my (non-domestic) partner had a well-appointed home studio, but had the same desires as me. So we started looking.

The first place was an old industrial site that is now kind of a business incubator and also storage-type place. We got three decent rooms for an incredibly low month-to-month rental fee, and I tacked-on a forth for an additional $50 a month just for personal storage. It was an awesome old place (scary and funky on the outside, kind of an urban vampire hang type of look, but we made it nice on the inside). We twisted their arms a bit, and they even put our own separate heating system in. The next year, we spent very little to get our own central air set-up too (my associate's day gig is in plumbing/heating/building supply).

The place had an _amazing_ staircase that I couldn't wait to turn into our own Motown chamber. But alas, it wasn't meant to be. They got the idea that "Hey, this band thing must be a goldmine!", and moved a couple of metal bands into the rooms right next door to us. It was very difficult to find time to work when they weren't practicing, and we were trying to build a business. It was already a scary looking place with a bathroom ladies wouldn't like to use; now we had "Marshalls on 11." Time to move.

My friend's connection in the building trades came in handy again, as he runs into a lot of guys that have properties they want to rent. Not far from our original location, we found a very nice, ranch house-type office building with six rooms for $100 more than what we were paying for three. Plus, nice, new, professional looking, with a lawn and a big parking lot, and an awesome bathroom, and no other bands or musicians. Bingo. The rest is somewhat history (it's still a work in progress), but I'm hoping to get a video tour up online sometime soon so y'all can check it out. Awesome place, but no chamber staircase. Oh well.

Bro Shark--

>>>>I think if one is willing to put 15-20 years into studio ownership without any significant return during that time, knowing at some point that bankruptcy will occur, and stomach the associated credit rape, one can keep a commercial studio running, and possibly even emerge sane and at a place where family members still talk to him/her.<<<<

This amazing quote will live on in the annals of Rock History like that thing that Elvis Costello (supposedly) said about "dancing about architecture;" like the Russ Kunkel "way of all bands" thing, like the Hunter S. Thompson "music business trench" analogy, or the famous Steve Albini record label diatribe. In short-- amazing encapsulation of the inescapable futility with which we willingly participate. As one of the jocks on a local Salsa program used to say: "I throw my hat out to you."

GJ

[MoreSpaceEcho]

thanks for that!

[chris harris]

I kinda lucked into my space. I was sharing studio space at another studio at the time and having a hard time getting the owner to put his schedule online to make it convenient for me to book the place. I was basically booking around his schedule and getting what was left. It just wasn't working. So, I had a contractor at my house doing some work on our kitchen. I just asked him to let me know if he comes across any commercial space for sale. He said he just happened to have a space that would be perfect. And, he was right. I had to do some build out. I had to do some (lots of) acoustic treatment.

But, he gave me a fair lease with a first right of refusal, should someone else make an offer before I'm ready to buy. I figured that renting for a while would give me a chance to check out the neighborhood and the building and hopefully run down any repairs that need to be done while it's still the building owner's responsibility. Glad I did. In the first year, he replaced the roof and the HVAC unit!

My current neighbor in the adjacent space literally IS a woodworking shop. The building is well constructed, though, and you can't hear any woodworking in the live room or iso rooms. I can occasionally hear saws or sanders from the control room if I'm dead silent and listen closely. But also, they're not really fellow "tenants" because the shop is owned by the contractor who owns the building. And, his first priority is for me to be able to successfully run my business there. So, I've got a green light from him to go over there and tell his guys to keep it down if it ever becomes a problem. I've only had to do it once, in the summer, when they moved some of their tools out of their shop and into the lounge directly adjacent to my control room. They were cool about it and I haven't had any trouble since. But, it'll definitely be nice to buy the building and not have to worry about anyone else in the adjacent space.
_________________
Studio - http://www.hookechosound.com
Label - http://www.wearenicepeople.com
Band - http://www.depthandcurrent.com
Twitter - http://www.twitter.com/HoodEchoSound