Where musician and recordist meet? good or bad experiences?

[llmonty]

I have been thinking about posting this question for a while

How has the recording process impacted your music?

I have found that recording my own music has had a profound impact on my writing. It also opens up the creative process and possibilities, but sometimes I think it might be a distraction that sends me off in a different direction (could be good or bad)

I find recording really helps me with arranging parts - spreading chord arrangements across a number of instruments, chord inversions, which octaves to play them in, echoing the melody, identifying tonal clashes etc. A great tool.

On the otherhand, my recording experience is based on 90% of my own music. I find that the way things get recorded sometimes changes the direction of the idea I had for the song - be it tempo, feel, atmosphere created, structure, riffs etc. I tend to record using multi-sources - both direct and room sounds, and sometimes throw some things up just to hear how they sound. Or maybe improvise over a part of the song. Inevitably I end up changing something about the song.

Does this represent a success as an artist (using recording as a creative tool) or a failure as an engineer (unable to realize the client's vision)?

I would love to have the opportunity to record other people's music to see if I can reconcile this.
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[cgarges]

[cgarges]

[janusmusic]

Well I've found that it makes me rush the whole songwriting process. I'm just eager to hit record and really have no idea(or a half baked idea) before I hit the button. Before I got some recording gear I was listening to the instrument very organic and natural. And when I started recording I was listening to it through headphones and hearing things differently..not saying it's good or bad just different.Sometimes the half baked idea rises into a beautifully delicious bunt cake of rock, but more oft than not it's just rolling tape, all learning I suppose. Lately just getting back to not turning on the tape machine until a song is done and I've played through it for weeks...that seems to work out better for me.
Brian

[Brian Brock]

I guess I've been thinking about this lately, especially in terms of my direction - more into recording, or back into songwriting?

Recording makes me actually sing the songs I write, which is really excellent. Practice vs. theory, you know.

But recording is this hugemongous thing unto itself, which to me as a songwriter is useful until it stops inspiring me to write.

Oh, but it's fun to make music...

[AnalogElectric]

For some it's a good thing, bad thing, or a different thing...oooh, that didn't make much sense.

Recording yourself or recording bands with decent equipment definitely allows a person to understand what works and what doesn't. I don't play in bands anymore and if I record anything of my own it's hard doing it by myself or I'll just perform noisecore type stuff for my personal amusement.

I’ve been playing ‘rock-type instruments’ since I was 12 but never really understood structure or near-perfect pitch until I was much older and was recording many bands. I record bands at the very least 4 days a week and I’ve heard the worst of worst and the best of best. There was a time where a singer kept telling me she was off pitch but I could not tell (early years). She kept trying it again and again until she was happy as I kept shrugging my shoulders not being able to understand what she was talking about; the takes sounded right to me. I captured a few bad takes to DAT so I could reference it to the final take she was happy with…that’s when things started to change for me. It wasn’t an overnight realization but from tuning my guitar for so many years before hand, developing a knack for certain pitches based from that, and later being able to monitor a mix with a finely in tune instrument against a vocal take, I can hear the subtle wavers.

Some people get very angry if I tell them to do a line/word over and over again because I hear it as being off pitch but in the long run what are a couple hours of abuse for a lifetime of perfection?

I base it on when I was younger, playing in bands, and recording before I was behind the helm. Most of the stuff I did in other bands was horrid regarding pitch, tuning, performance, etc. We went to a few studios and it never came up that I was off-pitch during a vocal take and I didn’t notice during playback or even after the final pressing was in our hands. Now when I hear the stuff I cringe, why didn’t I hear that before and why didn’t the engineer give a rat’s ass?

So, pitch and tuning is my big thing next to mic placement and mic choice. I think it has a lot to do with my early ‘hands-off-before-I-was-an-engineer-days’ that it made me so angry that pitch/tuning slides for something we were paying up the Yazoo for final press.

Song structure is a whole other can-of-worms especially if I never get to hear them before a session for ‘x’ amount of months. That’s where I separate an Engineer’s duties from that of a Producer.

The duty of a Producer is grey matter, it’s not written on a tablet somewhere exactly what a Producer does necessarily (especially these days) unless you talk to their lawyer, of course, and read the fine print.

Most of the bands I work with come in and record everything from full-lengths, EP’s, and demos. I consider myself an Engineer unless the band wants more input on song structure (basically then I’m a part in ‘arrangement’). As in pitch/tuning, arranging was something I identified with after a certain amount of time. Writing in a studio takes lots of time…lots and lots of time. Very few bands can do it within a timely manner. When a change is brought up I’ll hear at least a couple people (especially drummers) say, “I can’t change the part, that’s the way I’ve always played it. That’s the way I’ve done it live and at practice. Why didn’t you guys bring it up before?”

If I’m hired as a producer the best thing for me is to get slop recordings (boom-box or other from practices), let me sit in on practices with a notepad, see them live more than a few times, and be the ‘5th Beatle’ so to say. Bands hire a producer without knowing what they do. A band will hire a Producer, the Producer will help with fine-tuning songs, the Producer will find a studio, find an Engineer, and will be the mediator between what the band wants and what the Engineer needs to know in order to accomplish it.

Most of the time I handle both duties, Engineer and Producer. There has been a few occasions where I did strictly one or the other but if I’m a Producer (proper) I’m going to make sure it’s spot on.

Before I get too deep in to all that stuff…

If you’re discovering the possibilities with what you’re doing now, cool. From my experience I learn a lot more from working with all different level bands. There’s a good friend of mine I think should be a Producer. Every time he comes in with his new group of the month he has the Producer sense of things. I did not have that right off the bat or even some years in to my professional recording venture. He didn’t write the songs but when him and I would record with his band mates he had the ‘it-factor’, a certain sensibility beyond the controls. Maybe it’s a great working relationship we have or he knows what he/the band wants and knows how to translate that to me (i.e. the responsibility of a Producer).

Because I don’t get to Produce as much as I’d like to or carry both Producer/Engineer duties, I can’t hear the possibilities until most of the main tracks are down on tape (or computer—whichever you maybe).

Certain tones and feel of the finish pressing has a lot to do with your hire-ability. As much as any of us try to escape certain qualities from our approach/mixes there’s a certain amount of personality that’s transparent to the final results we cannot escape but can only identify and go with; acceptance. Hiring Producers, Engineers, and studios is base on what comes out, in the long run. It’s hard getting to a point where there have been certain ‘black-marks’ on my track record and solidifying the progression since then.

Some of the best stuff I’ve ever done is narrowly out there for the mass public around the world or the band breaks up as soon as 2 days after a mix. On the other foot, there are things out there I despise that has made mass popular favor but that’s not ME…wholly.

I gave up writing a long time ago because I like hearing other peoples music and where it can go from there. If I was to do anything on my own I don’t think it would be revolutionary but I know it would be better than what I did back from the early days.

I’m not sick of songwriting or recording my own stuff but I think I’m sick of dealing with band ‘marriage’. I prefer to do my own stuff solo these days but learning what I have by hearing other bands tells me other valuable self-opinion lessons in regard to ‘what I like to hear in a song’, ‘when too much of one great idea is overkill’, ‘understanding the audience/band’, ‘going with my gut’, ‘don’t be afraid to take a chance’ and ‘take criticism lightly’.

I think my enthusiasm for the post reply has taken its course so, I don’t think you fail either way. I can’t please everyone that comes in (especially if it’s on blind faith or referral and not from several audio examples) but I do know what I like and a challenge of doing something ‘off the cuff’ or not the norm of what I’m accustom to.

The more you record (with yourself or with other bands) the more you’re going to grow as an artist. If I didn’t have bands coming in with all different styles I don’t think I’d be half the musician I am today or Engineer/Producer.

--Adam Lazlo
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Gilbert, Arizona USA
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