relective/absorbitive surfaces, carpet vs hardwood/tile?

[xonlocust]

hello all-

everything i've read leads me to believe carpet on the floor in the studio is a bad idea, that you want a reflective floor, and absorbitive ceiling. my question is mostly a theoretical one, why not an absorbitive floor and reflective ceiling? in theory, if there were carpet on the floor it would absorb mid/high, but not bass, which you'd address through bass trapping. but with a reflective floor, you have to address all frequencies on the ceiling and corners.

what say ye knowledgeable folk?

i'm real close to having to make a decision i have to live with for a long time, so your input is greatly appreciated. carpet is obviously cheaper.

thanks in advance,
nick

[blunderfonics]

I think that the idea that "you want a reflective floor, and absorbitive ceiling" might be a bit of a over generalization or a bit of 'internet wisdom'. This is not necessarily the case. Where you put absorption depends greatly on the size and geometry of the room.

If you look at photos of professionally designed studios you will see reflective, apsorptive and diffusive surfaces everywhere. Apsorptive and diffusive surfaces are added to a) help achieve the desired reverb time and liveness and b) attempt to control undesireable acoustic problems such as flutter echoes and room modes.

There are some kernals of truth in what you've read:

I think that the reflective-floor/absorptive ceiling thing comes from the fact that a lot of people are working in residential spaces with low ceilings. With a couple of mics positioned over a drum kit they are likely to be closer to the ceiling than they are to the floor. In this case the dead ceiling helps cut down on the very early reflections you'd otherwise have arriving in the overhead mics and causing phase issues with the direct sound from the cymbals. Keeping the floor live in this type of situation helps the room from being too dead sounding. If you have high ceilings you don't have this problem and using carpeting to control the liveness of the room might be a good idea.

The other part of the reason you seldom see carpeting in tracking rooms is more about maintainence and wear and tear issues that arise from heavy, dirty, stinky gear being dragged across your floor on a daily basis.

[xonlocust]

ah, yes! the overheads, that makes much sense. thanks for the clarification.

the space in question is in an attic. roughly 9 & 10 ft ceilings (though only at the "flat" part, there are angled walls as well following the roof line to the kneewalls.

i was wondering because as i think about it, many control rooms i've been in have been carpeted, as are "dead rooms" - which seems to go against the "internet wisdom". of course the ceilings are treated in all of these situations as well, and full on bass trapping, helmholz resonators etc...

any other input?

thx blunder!

add: here's something relevant i found for those watching:

http://www.auralex.com/auralex_acoustic ... s.asp?Q=14

[I'm Painting Again]

I really think it just depends on what the hell is going on in your specific situation..I've heard stories of big $$ rooms being built and just stopped in the middle of construction because it sounded "right" there in mid-build!..hard floors reduce static buildup on your person as well as let heavy boom roller stands, camera peds, etc slide with ease..easier to keep cleen..and it looks nicer..I would go with a hard floor..of pergo maybe because it will give it a nice look and be much cheaper than real wood..I have the same booking agent as one of the bands(bangbang) on your links..do whats logical to you I guess..

[xonlocust]

BOB-

cool. yeah, well - pergo was my first choice. my contractor says that my subfloor isn't flat enough and gives a bit, so w/pergo the individual pieces will flex at joints and be succeptible to cracks. they then suggested carpet to me, to which i was not real into for all the reasons stated above and elsewhere. so now they're looking into a firm that "speaks not a lick of english" for a deal on real wood, which will address the substandard (ha!) subfloor.

which band are you in? i'm in bang bang now too. originally i was just filling in for a few shows, now for more so maybe they should be moved from the associates status. maybe we'll play some shows together!

nick

[I'm Painting Again]

Blue Velvet..we are right next to each other on the Noise Problem mainpage!! I'm sure we could do a show together in the future..We are around Chi every summer and were always home in NYC if you get out here..

That flooring situation is shite man..if you own the place and plan on being there long..get it fixed right even if its expensive..because down the line its going to cause big problems if the subfloor is fucked..fix that and rock the pergo!

[brian beattie]

Nick
My understanding is that carpet ONLY absorbs higher frequencies, and the frequencies usually needing taming in a well sealed structure are the mid to low frequencies. So with carpet, you'd probably be attenuating the treble frequencies in a room that's most likely already too bassy or low-midrangey, throwing it even more off balance. If your ceiling is absorptive, it's usually thick stuff which will work on the larger, more oppressive frequencies. Also, quite often, the ceiling and floor are the largest parallel planes, so they'll be a large part of the specific resonance of a room. A thicker layer of absorption can fix that, but carpeting could just make it sound muddier.
I've heard it described something like this- carpeting could work just as well if it were a 2 foot deep shag made of fiberglass...
brian

[Harry]

one thing to think about is the fact that the drums will almost always be on some kind of rug so direct reflection from the floor to drum overheads is kind of a nonissue.
I think most of your reclection/deadening choices will come from your walls and ceiling.
Plus most of the time your floor will be 90% covered in gear and or people.

But if you have a bigass room where you actully have room to spare then "real" wood floors would be awesome!!

I could be completely wrong though???

[xonlocust]

thanks for the input so far! looks like it's gonna be real wood. the space is big enough to have room about. i'm guessing but live room is roughly 12x20 and CR is like 14x20 or something like that. so, not bigass, but not super tiny either. it's still a home studio. i gave up trying to make it a "hardcore studio" in favor of the almighty "resale value" (funny how once you actually own that comes into play) and am trying to straddle the line for future homebuyers, while still remaining a functinal space. probably no full on rock bands but great for ODs and full band quiet stuff. there are so many great studios around to track basics at and bring home to finish.