A Beyer Ribbon and a Pre to love it

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lofilothario
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A Beyer Ribbon and a Pre to love it

Post by lofilothario » Mon Feb 20, 2006 9:23 am

Hello all, I just got a Beyer M260DX and have been using it through a Sytek and a RNP which work fine for loud sources but not nearly enough gain for acoustic guitars/voice/strings. So my question is- what high gain pre's can you suggest i try out. I was looking at the Grace 101. I'd like to spend between $500-1000. Any and all suggestions appreciated.

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eeldip
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Post by eeldip » Mon Feb 20, 2006 9:59 am

sweet, you live in san juan? love that city. gotta get back there soon...

anyway, this i use an earthworks lab series pre with ribbons and i really love it. it has less noise at full gain 66db than at 0db. 66db of near noise free gain is usually enough. if you have to follow it with a line amp, no biggie. when not used with ribbons the pre is a bit boring, but i find its AMAZING with all super colored mics.

anyway, i got mine for $300, cause people hate them

they are rare... might take you a while to find one used, but their value on the used market is way lower than they are worth.

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Post by cgarges » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:06 am

Man, the Sytek has a ridiclous amount of gain and I use mine all the time with low-output mics, including Beyers. It's also an incredibly quiet pre. There may be something out there that will work better (like the aforementioned Earthworks), but I certainly don't know of anything in that price range that fits the criteria.

Not to be dark or anything, but sometimes you just have to move on. If your source is really THAT quiet, then perhaps a quieter mic with a higher output would be better-suited to the source at hand.

Chris Garges
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lofilothario
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Post by lofilothario » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:31 am

Not to be dark or anything, but sometimes you just have to move on. If your source is really THAT quiet, then perhaps a quieter mic with a higher output would be better-suited to the source at hand.
I hear ya, the thing is, the sources aren't that quiet. I have the mic 6" from the grill on a 80 Watt gtr amp up a little more than halfway (worthy of earplugs loud) and the sytek cranked all the way and I get a barely useable signal level-wise...Aggressive strummed acoustic guitar, vox....if more than 3" away doesn't pick up anything. I knew ribbons were low output but damn.

sweet, you live in san juan? love that city. gotta get back there soon...

anyway, this i use an earthworks lab series pre with ribbons and i really love it. it has less noise at full gain 66db than at 0db. 66db of near noise free gain is usually enough. if you have to follow it with a line amp, no biggie. when not used with ribbons the pre is a bit boring, but i find its AMAZING with all super colored mics
Yeah San Juan can be a lot of fun but it can also be downright boring. Great for a visit though. I'm actually heading west LA or San Fran, haven't decided which yet, within the next 6 months.

Thanks for the tip on the earthworks, i'll keep an eye out for that.

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Post by cgarges » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:36 am

lofilothario wrote:I hear ya, the thing is, the sources aren't that quiet. I have the mic 6" from the grill on a 80 Watt gtr amp up a little more than halfway (worthy of earplugs loud) and the sytek cranked all the way and I get a barely useable signal level-wise...Aggressive strummed acoustic guitar, vox....if more than 3" away doesn't pick up anything. I knew ribbons were low output but damn.
Not to be all dark or anything (ha ha), but I think something's wrong.

Chris Garges
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eeldip
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Post by eeldip » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:42 am

yea, something is messed up with your ribbon perhaps. i mean, i dont want to jump to conclusions, but SOMETHING is up. usually 60db or so is enough for acoustic guitar if you are within 3 feet. i have two m260s of different vintages, and they both behave that way.

so where do you live in san juan? what hood? i've only been there once and never left the old city... whats that city like to live in? its definately the most um.. unique american city.

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Post by rodabod » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:59 am

cgarges wrote:
lofilothario wrote:I hear ya, the thing is, the sources aren't that quiet. I have the mic 6" from the grill on a 80 Watt gtr amp up a little more than halfway (worthy of earplugs loud) and the sytek cranked all the way and I get a barely useable signal level-wise...Aggressive strummed acoustic guitar, vox....if more than 3" away doesn't pick up anything. I knew ribbons were low output but damn.
Not to be all dark or anything (ha ha), but I think something's wrong.
Thirded.

60dB should be fine for that. I've heard of others having problems with the DX mod too. Did you buy it like that or did you get it re-ribboned yourself? The Beyers are quite high output for ribbons.

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lofilothario
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Post by lofilothario » Mon Feb 20, 2006 12:41 pm

aww crap i was afraid of that. I bought it used. Anyone happen to know the number for Beyer? or a good place to have it reribnoned?

so where do you live in san juan? what hood? i've only been there once and never left the old city... whats that city like to live in? its definately the most um.. unique american city.
I live in Condado, very close to the old city, actually it would take me 20 minutes to walk there. The old city is great, especially for the music festivals and the drinking festivals haha Outside of the old city yeah it is quite unique...no city planning....a church next to a hi rise next to a house next to a blockbuster video. It isn't living as much as it is surviving haha worst drivers in the world, no enforcement of traffic laws...free for all. other than that it's great, lotta beach, cute girls, rum.

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Post by rodabod » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:01 pm

lofilothario wrote:aww crap i was afraid of that. I bought it used. Anyone happen to know the number for Beyer? or a good place to have it reribnoned?
Did you get it off Ebay? How long ago? Pay by Paypal? If so, demand your money back by Paypal by charging back, or similar.

I'd get Beyer to re-ribbon it, but ask them to not turnm it into a M260.80 (this is the current version of the M260 which has a steep bass roll-off). They have a service department in New York - call or email them via their website.

If you want to have them re-ribboned elsewhere, try Enak (Clarence Kane). I'd try Beyer first though, as they use a specific type of ribbon which is manufactured by themselves.

Good luck.

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eeldip
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Post by eeldip » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:39 pm

lofilothario wrote:It isn't living as much as it is surviving haha worst drivers in the world, no enforcement of traffic laws...free for all. other than that it's great, lotta beach, cute girls, rum.
man, i saw some serious traffic violations while driving the autopistas. dude pulls up to toll booth on huge interstate. decides, fuck this, i aint payin. does a U turn, starts driving down the hiway THE WRONG DIRECTION until he hits a grassy median he can cross over.

its fucking nuts driving down an interstate and watching someone driving TOWARDS you.

etc. every 5 minutes i would see a driving move that shocked me.

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Post by ivanovich » Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:59 pm

I've tried my m130 with the api 512 and the grace 101. for drums i found either to just be ok. maybe the grace 101 has a little bit more output with less noise. definately not for violin, or any thing like that.

the best combination that i've ever used the m130 with is the ampex 350 and the 351. you can get those pretty cheap. i wouldn't spend more than 300 or 400 bucks for them. man, they have a lot of gain and barely (if no) noise at all. but it has to be set up right by an expert.

i wonder how these mics would sound like with a john hardy, dw fearn, the vipre, or any of the nicely designed pre's out there. i have NOT tried any of these combinations, but i'm in the market for a john hardy mp2. does anyone here have any real life experience with beyer/john hardy or any other mic pre's?

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Post by inverseroom » Mon Feb 20, 2006 5:09 pm

I've been using a Hamptone JFET with my M160. It's really great. I could stand a little more headroom--one of the nice things about the JFET is its breakup--but I'm planning to build the tube version and will see if that does the trick.

Anyway, it's nice gain, and plenty for the M160.

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Post by I'm Painting Again » Mon Feb 20, 2006 5:23 pm

ivanbambam wrote:the th is the ampex 350 and the 351. you can get those pretty cheap.
not these days it seems..

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Post by joelpatterson » Mon Feb 20, 2006 5:30 pm

I think it's kind of crazy how roads are built so that people travelling in opposite directions are continuously almost grazing each other... add to that the fertile tropical climes... you got a party!

I just ordered a second Grace 101, I really like 'em. They make a version of the 101 that's good for 70 db gain, and I for one would trust it sight unseen, and they sure harp on the "ribbon" suitability of it.

But I notice something that in the world of 24 bit digital, you can hike the gain ridiculously on anything that was recorded at whisper level and turn it into a scream with no trouble. So there's a random thought.
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lofilothario
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Post by lofilothario » Tue Feb 21, 2006 7:46 am

etc. every 5 minutes i would see a driving move that shocked me.
I think my favorite traffic violation, and a common one here, is when a cop car pulls up to a red light, turns the siren on, cruises through the light then immediately turns the siren off and goes on his/her merry way hahaha talk about abuse of power.
the ampex 350 and the 351. you can get those pretty cheap.
These seem to be going for about a grand on ebay.


Thanks for all the recommendations, I'll definitely be checking out some if not most of them.

Now an update on the mic...strange things are happening with it. Yesterday afternoon i went into the studio and lo and behold the M260 was useable...much better levels than before....then a few hours later it was back down to barely picking up anything. could this be temperature/humidity related???

When the levels were good the mic sounded great, a very full smooth sound.

I don't know I'm confused. :?

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