Breaking Ribbon Mics.

[thearnicasync]

I just downloaded the spec sheet for the AEA R84 mic. There are three big warnings with regard to handling. I'm nervous, so I have a couple of questions for those of you might have experience with the ribbon mics...

1. How explosive do the these bursts of air need to be to break a ribbon? I mean, is it absolutely necessary to use a pop filter? If I can feel it say, six inches in front of my mouth, is it too strong? Even if I feel it just a little? Is there a rule of thumb for this?

2. From the spec sheet: "When plugged into a defective cable or out-of-balance phantom power supply, the 48 volt phantom pulse causes the ribbon to leap out of it's magnetic gap and snap in half." How violent!

When they say defective cable, I understand that. But what's an out of balance phantom power supply? I ask because I f-ing built the pres (hamptone) and, well, could my phantom power supply be out of balance? How could I tell?

Thanks...and my apologies for being so ignorant!

kelly

[soundguy]

yo. you get those kind of warnings because people are fucking idiots and manufacturers have to print that shit to protect themselves from the idiots that buy their products. Sad, but true. So far as recordign engineers are concerned, you will HEAR your ribbon stressing and moving around long before you break it from normal use. If you go sneeze into your mic or something, you might be out of luck, but just singing in front of it, you will hear that you are too close if you are overstressing the ribbon. It doesnt sound good at all. That said, I ALWAYS put a pop filter in front of a ribbon. It aint gonna hurt it, right?

You should have very tightly matched 6.8K resistors, (or whatever value resistor you used) coming from the phantom supply to the mic input. Just take your multimeter and measure the voltage with the phantom circuit on, you should have an identical reading. not a big deal.

All in all, ribbon mics are indeed fragile, but a lot of noise is made about it simply because professionals (or whatever you want to call someone with experience) arent handling these tools exclusively and you have a lot of home recording guys with this gear (cool!). So long as you dont do stupid things with it, you'll be fine, and the paranoia that lasts after reading the aea stuff is enough to keep your mic safe. I was terrified to use my 4038 on ANYTHING loud until one day I just said fuck it, I paid all this money for a mic, Im gonna use the fucker and just pay the $100 for a new ribbon when I break it. well, Ive been following that attitude for about 8 years now and I havent replaced the ribbon yet, so... I dont know if there is a more fragile ribbon than what is in the 4038. Just use your head and all will be good.

dave

[thearnicasync]

Thanks, Dave. That's all I needed to hear.

You mention matching resistors. Honestly, I don't know how to measure what you're talking about. I guess I can just ask Scott or something. But, does, the phantom power rule thing apply even if it's disengaged? I know it's best to wait a few minutes for the caps to dissipate charge.

Thanks to anyone who understands what the hell I'm asking...I probably don't. Maybe I don't have any business with a nice ribbon if I can't even be sure I won't destroy it.

[thearnicasync]

Wait a minute. To measure this, do I just multimeter between the two pins and check for a certain voltage/ohms or something?

Thanks,

Rupert Neve

[soundguy]

no no no!~

between the 48v supply and your mic, there are two resistors one on pin 2 and one on pin3. The most common value used is 6.8K You just want to make sure that you have a precisely matched set of resistors there so that you have the identical voltage running on both rails. To measure it you want to take your multimeter set to DC and measure between the resistor ad ground annd you should see about 48v. Honestly, though, I really wouldnt tweak on that. Ive never lost a ribbon to phantom. Just be smart and dont worry. If you dont turn the phantom on, you really shouldnt have to worry. The paranoia is enough to keep you safe. go record something and stop worryig about this bs.

dave

[thearnicasync]

Dave, you're a goddamn saint.

[soundguy]

Im actually just an asshole, but dont tell anyone.

dave

[joel hamilton]

I have plugged in my RCA BK5 like 6 times to a channel with the phantom on ( I dont WANT to do it, I was in the moment...) and it is fine.I use that mic in front of loud rock guitar amps ALL THE TIME.

I have put an oktava ML-52 in front of an SVT cab CRANKED to the gills. It let me know it was unhappy long before the ribbon exploded.

I have a late forties/early fifties tannoy large ribbon that I have put up in front of a rocking amp, and it sounded really, really good. It also sounds great on just about anything I have bothered to put it on, including as a room mic.

Things break sometimes. people tell stupid stories about ribbon mics all the time like " I would NEVER put mine up in front of the kick" or "that thing will die a horrible death if you try to use it on [insert anything here]"

That would be like never driving on route 95 because you heard there was a horrible accident on it once.

I agree with Dave: use your head, and have fun. GO RECORD SOMETHING!

[soundguy]

I had heard somewhere that the BK5 was designed to record firearms at close range. I dont know who told me that, stephen sank maybe. I wonder if thats true. Not that that really matters, I guess the space shuttle was designed to land on earth safely. Whatever. things break.

dave

[joel hamilton]

No wonder it has been one of my favorite microphones for a long time!

I dont even care if that is true. I am sticking with it.

"this mic was made to record guns."

Awesome.

[soundguy]

real question is what was the rft designed for??? Id like to start a rumor that states "rft mic originally packaged with lube".

ouch.

dave

[joel hamilton]

The RFT was made for "Critical dialogue and speech recording" or some stupid wording like that.

There is a guy selling one on ebay lately. I saw TWO actually. Crazy!

I NEVER meet people who even know what the 7151 IS, never mind having one of their own.

I love that mic like a son.

[AGCurry]

My Oktava ML52 died suddenly without any abuse whatsoever.

I used my first R84 for my cantorial gig this Rosh Hashanah. Plugged it in with phantom power on. Somebody blew into it before I could stop him. I tripped on the cable once and it fell over. Worked great the whole time.

I think soundguy and Joel are right on about the phantom power. It's not the phantom power itself which is harmful - it's whether everything is working right and wired right.

[assfortress]

what about a beyer m500 about a foot away from the snare would this fuck it up- has anyone used a ribbon anywhere near a snare.

[joel hamilton]

I have one of those beyer M500 "classic" thingy's,
and I have never used it on snare. Not because I think it would explode, but because I have better choices.

I HAVE used it in front of some pretty gnarly amps, though. Like a twin blasting loud, and a 100 watt plexi with a 4x12 BLAZINGLY loud.

It handled it. those are pretty solid.

Ribbons blow up from mis-use and abuse, not from recording sounds.

I have really put ribbons in stupid places, and they get grumpy LONG before the blow up.

You will hear an unhappy ribbon, then run in and put it away and put something else up. no big deal. The same thing happens with condensers...?>?>>>>?