Building a non-permanent recording space in rental

[caz]

Dearest TapeOppers,

I'd like to gather some ideas from y'all... I have just relocated from Detroit to Chicago, but due to the worldwide economic woes I am unable to sell my home back in Michigan and will be renting a place in Chicago. Because of this situation I can not do anything permanent in my new garage space. Thus I was thinking of building something like a giant isolation box, or a room-within-a-room type of thing in my new garage. It is a two-car concrete slab, wooden walled garage that I plan on using one whole side for my recording space. I've had good results in small, mostly dead spaces before, also I'm a fan of engineer/producer Tchad Blake who has recorded some great drum sounds in a 7' by 10' vocal booth. The main use for this giant iso-box would be for recording drums in a manner that on a given Saturday afternoon I wouldn't completely drive the neighbors crazy.

So, what should I do? Do I build some sort of floating or decoupled floor, then build insulated walls which do not come in contact with the drum floor? What about a ceiling or a top for my box? I have about a 20' by 10' space to work with and about a 10 foot high ceiling space.

Any suggestions are welcomed,
{csmr}

[norton]

Sorry to hear about the real estate situation.

The portable garage thing sounds really interesting.

I think the main thing that's going to be problematic with this kind of "non-permanent" situation is weight. In order for the walls to work even marginally well - they're going to have a fair amount of heft to them.

BUT...I think you can do this. 2' on center framing is very effective for soundproofing applications. And it will make your modular panels lighter. Steel studs are even lighter than wood and could be used for internal structure or bracing.

Sooo.....General Concept Only ....but I think this might work. Frame a box out of 2x4's. 4'x8' sheeting one side with 1/4 sheetrock - greenglue - and 1/4 sheetrock then insulate the cavity - and possibly putting in some sort of brace in the center - short side to short side.
Then sheet the other side with the same sandwich.

I think the weight will be somewhere in the 100lbs a panel area. Which is relatively movable with 2 people.

Now comes the tough part.... How to attach? I think that you could make these modular panels fasten together from the outside with relative ease. Perhaps each panel has a wooden reveal of 3/4" and the panels are oriented horizontally.... at each end that has a corner - you could come up with some sort of system that allowed the corners to be fastened together with bolts/screws etc...

In general concept something like this would work. You'd get your high stc #'s and be able to keep what you've built and move it.

As far as details go.... i need more caffeine.

Anyone else? am I crazy?

[standup]

Do shipping containers come in 10x20? If it would fit through the door maybe you could rent a roll-off-container company to pull it out of the garage and haul it to the next location.... I think on the John Sayers' site there are some pics of a shipping container studio.

[myfipie]

I would search around town for a studio that you can use for just cutting the drums then do the other things back at your place. I am sure you could work a pretty good deal with someone.

Glenn

PS Also I am sorry to hear about the house not selling.

[caz]

Thanks for your replies... I am a committed self-recorder so I really am interested in recording at home. I love the unique results of your own space no matter it's limitations. That said, I am wondering if it would make sense to build a semi-modular box (4 walls & ceiling) perhaps based on Sepmeyer dimensions & 2-leaf Mass-Air-Mass construction on top of the original garage floor, but purchase something like Auralex's HoverDeck to put the drums on inside my giant iso-box instead of building the difficult floating floor above the original concrete floor of the garage? I think I may also put rockwool in the original walls of the garage (covered by burlap) to help matters a bit further.

Any ideas with this approach?

Thanks so very much!
{csmr}

[JWL]

If it really needs to be portable, the shipping container idea is probably the best thing you can do.

Anything you can do for good soundproofing (and note that a floating wooden deck does not fit into this category) will involve some pretty heavy-duty construction, and subsequent teardown when it's time to move.

The closest you could probably come is to build inside-out walls in 4x8 modular sections, fasten them directly to the concrete (not sure how to do this temporarily), and seal it up with caulk. It could be removed/salvaged, but not easily.

[caz]

Yeah, it really just needs to be able to be removed without a problem...we may be there for only one year. If I built a dense floor on rubber u-boats or pucks and then built a room around that which did not touch the walls and a ceiling, would that work to isolate the drums from the original concrete floor of the garage and then the new walls & ceiling would assist in dampening the sound that leaks out in the neighborhood?

[vxboogie]

Yeah, it really just needs to be able to be removed without a problem...we may be there for only one year. If I built a dense floor on rubber u-boats or pucks and then built a room around that which did not touch the walls and a ceiling, would that work to isolate the drums from the original concrete floor of the garage and then the new walls & ceiling would assist in dampening the sound that leaks out in the neighborhood?

I'm not real knowledgeable in this area, but I'm confused as to why you would need a floating/isolated floor when you are on concrete? From what I've seen in my basement studio, you aren't going to get much transmission or vibration from that. Maybe I'm just missing it here.

[roscoenyc]

most garages are about as soundproof as a tent.
soundproofing takes a lot of material. There really is no way around mass.

[Sean Shannon]

I don't think that you'll getting complete soundproofing, but building a freestanding frame-within-a-frame room for the space would be fairly easy. Make the walls as heavy as you can. like the post above states. Carpet reduces a lot of bouncing sound, and treat the walls for absorption. It gets a little complicated with regard to air conditioning and electrical, but easily doable.

Then build a drum riser (basically heavy wood covered in carpet sitting on fiberglass panels) instead of a floating floor, mine is only about 3" tall, and that should help with the through-the-floor drum vibrations, and help tighten up the drum sounds. Another thing that helps is to build gobos for around the drumkit to absorb the blast.

The best you can hope for is decent isolation from outside noise and the ability to play without driving neighbors nuts.

[Gorilla]

Just hurry up, we want another Pas Cal album, the last one was fantastic.

Summer is Almost Here finds it's way on to nearly every mix and play list I make.

If you are most worried about reducing the sound for the neighbors, lots of rock wool or similarly heavy/dense insulation seem like a good place to start and don't forget about the door.

Good luck with the house, I haven't had to sell mine yet, but I certainly can relate.

[myfipie]

If it really needs to be portable, the shipping container idea is probably the best thing you can do.

Anything you can do for good soundproofing (and note that a floating wooden deck does not fit into this category) will involve some pretty heavy-duty construction, and subsequent teardown when it's time to move.

The closest you could probably come is to build inside-out walls in 4x8 modular sections, fasten them directly to the concrete (not sure how to do this temporarily), and seal it up with caulk. It could be removed/salvaged, but not easily.

I would agree, but I would measure the height of the container to make sure it would fit though the garage door.

How about buying pizza and beer for the neighbors?

Glenn

[gabe real]

hello, i once built a semi removable studio in a artist loft. i was able to rip the whole
thing out upon moving out. it took a long time though. i used to much sealant.

i just built a room inside a room not floated or anything.

now, keep in mind a housing/building inspector will most likely make you
tear it done. just had to put that out there before i explain any more.

you could just simply build sections, 4x8. or even 8x8.
then screw them together with rubber or foam in between.
so it would be a modular system that could be used at another location.

just simple frames, kind of like diffusers with drywall on the back.
or one leaf walls with the insulation exposed on the inside of room.
you could cover the walls with painters drop cloth.

then you could build a roof with 2x2's for support and drywall on top.
insulation on that as well.

you will need a door to. you can just make one section with that in it.
you could make the door instead of buying one.
simple frame with plywood on hinges.
insulation on inside of door and rubber/foam seal where it touches frame.

i was able to push and pull 8x8 section by myself. it had studs every 2 feet too.

do you have pictures? sometimes all you need is insulation on the walls
and seal up all the air gaps.

keep in mind, its not a load baring room. so the walls dont have to be as
strong as regular walls.

its still not exactly up to building code, but it will be sturdy if you know
what your doing.

i can give you more details too.
this is a "build at your on risk" thing though.