Lame sexist Mackie advertisement

[chris harris]

And not to split hairs too much...but, I will...
but if you only jerk off about things that are real...dude, I'm sorry. You've really missed the point.

yeah.

*doesn't jerk off to cartoons*

[>Mojave_Gary<]

if you guys are really turned on by that ad, I'd suggest getting out of the basement/house/studio/internet every once in a while. Actually interacting with real humans may be the only thing that can cure you of your "hot for cartoons" disease. That ad has so much Photoshop work done that it makes me question whether or not a model was even needed for the ad.

Actually, if you are taking our 'fooling about' as seriously as your post would make it seem then perhaps you sir are the one that should get out of the; and I quote, "basement/house/studio/internet" every once in a while.

I kinda agree with Gary--you may be hanging on a bit too tightly sir.

Hey... I just find it curious to be turned on by something that's obviously not real.

I guess I knew that cartoon porn existed. And, I'm not saying that people shouldn't be into it. They've got just as much right to be into it as I do pointing and laughing at them for getting off to cartoons.

It does concern me a bit, though, for my little niece to be growing up in a world where the standard of beauty is some ridiculous cartoon image that can not possibly be achieved through natural means or fitness.

And, sorry for coming off a little "holier than thou"... but, I have to admit, I do consider myself a little more evolved than dudes who jerk off to cartoons.

For someone who considers him/her self to be 'more-evolved', you obviously do not know the difference between what is computer-generated eroticism at best and what you call 'cartoon porn' which, I have to think, would include images of animated characters engaged in sexual activities which the afore-mentioned image does not. As for your assumption that, because a person can appreciate an artistic depiction, erotic or otherwise, of a human being, is an indication of some sort of masturbatory addiction to 'cartoon porn'; A generalized way of thinking such as this can only be a direct reflection of something that you believe to be true about yourself. Also, although I applaud your 'more-evolved' self-image, I have to say that your over-dramatic, insulting response to our tongue-in-cheek humor concerning this thread, would indicate something much darker and emotional than simply a 'more-evolved' state of being. IMHO

[Jay Reynolds]

This thread gets awesomer by the minute.
I'd like to personally thank the Clinton Volunteer/Behringer Marketing Guy who trolled this one up for us.

[JGriffin]

And not to split hairs too much...but, I will...
but if you only jerk off about things that are real...dude, I'm sorry. You've really missed the point.

yeah.

*doesn't jerk off to cartoons*

Nice!

* doesn't admit what he does or does not jerk off to on messageboards *

[chris harris]

Oh, geex, the "my little niece" argument. Dude.

The standard of beauty is fucked into a cocked hat regardless of the existence of cartoon porn. Plastic surgeons are reporting young girls asking for work that the models and movie stars haven't even had.

Is this the whole, "things are so bad already. there's nothing you can do about it. so, you might as well jerk off to cartoons" argument?

Cartoon porn obviously isn't the sole reason behind body-image problems in young girls. But, it's a pretty good example of what a problem it is. It's also pretty disheartening that there are so many dudes out there who are such slaves to their horniness that they're even turned on by cartoons. I guess there are all kinds of fetishes and mine might not seem any more normal to you than cartoon lust seems to me. It just seems sad to me. Criticize me all you want. But, I am concerned about what my niece is growing up around. I know that I can't stop cartoon porn, or obviously fake looking photoshopping or plastic surgery, from being viewed as attractive. But, I can speak up about how fucking ridiculous it is. And, I can do my best to let her know how I feel about it.

[chris harris]

For someone who considers him/her self to be 'more-evolved', you obviously do not know the difference between what is computer-generated eroticism at best and what you call 'cartoon porn' which, I have to think, would include images of animated characters engaged in sexual activities which the afore-mentioned image does not. As for your assumption that, because a person can appreciate an artistic depiction, erotic or otherwise, of a human being, is an indication of some sort of masturbatory addiction to 'cartoon porn'; A generalized way of thinking such as this can only be a direct reflection of something that you believe to be true about yourself. Also, although I applaud your 'more-evolved' self-image, I have to say that your over-dramatic, insulting response to our tongue-in-cheek humor concerning this thread, would indicate something much darker and emotional than simply a 'more-evolved' state of being. IMHO

You're right... I'm not hip to the intricacies of "computer-generated eroticism"...

Guess I'm not as evolved as I thought.

I call it "cartoon porn" to mock people who are turned on by things that are obviously fake. I'm sure that you're just appreciating the artistic statement made by these exaggerated body parts in "computer-generated erotica". And, I'm sure that the photoshopped image in that advertisement was intended to be appreciated for it's artistic achievement.

[chris harris]

I don't really care what any one else jerks off to.
I just think that defending sexism is lame. And, treating it as a joke is lame. And, accusing people of being oversensitive about issues that are real is lame. And, not caring is lame.

But, the lamest is being afraid to even mention that something may be inappropriate or offensive because you're afraid that some macho prick will try to make you feel like a pussy for caring.

Sexism is a lot like racism in that it can be very subtle. And, people can get away with it in certain company because they've either surrounded themselves with like (small) minded people or have successfully intimidated the others in the group to ignore it. But, chances are, even when you think that you're safe being a racist or sexist, there are probably people around who think less of you for it.

Am I being too sensitive? too sensitive for what? this thread is a discussion about a very real and a very serious issue. I guess I could stuff my tongue in my cheek and make jokes about it and pretend that it's not really a problem. But, I won't.

[JGriffin]

Oh, geex, the "my little niece" argument. Dude.

The standard of beauty is fucked into a cocked hat regardless of the existence of cartoon porn. Plastic surgeons are reporting young girls asking for work that the models and movie stars haven't even had.

Is this the whole, "things are so bad already. there's nothing you can do about it. so, you might as well jerk off to cartoons" argument?

No, it isn't.

Cartoon porn obviously isn't the sole reason behind body-image problems in young girls. But, it's a pretty good example of what a problem it is. It's also pretty disheartening that there are so many dudes out there who are such slaves to their horniness that they're even turned on by cartoons. I guess there are all kinds of fetishes and mine might not seem any more normal to you than cartoon lust seems to me. It just seems sad to me. Criticize me all you want. But, I am concerned about what my niece is growing up around. I know that I can't stop cartoon porn, or obviously fake looking photoshopping or plastic surgery, from being viewed as attractive. But, I can speak up about how fucking ridiculous it is. And, I can do my best to let her know how I feel about it.

How is getting turned on by "cartoon porn" (however we're defining it) any more about being a "slave to horniness" than any other fetish? Or any other form of erotica/porn--since it's ALL an artificial construct? Man, that's narrowminded. I don't get turned on by pregnant chicks or clowns or really skinny girls or shit-tons of piercings, but I don't look down on those who do. Everyone's got their thing. If you're really concerned about your niece growing up in a world with narrow standards of beauty, you're already one step behind on that.

Anyway, having a hang-up about what other people find sexy is one issue, which I can't help you with. As far as your niece, and other young women (and men) around the world, yes--it is a problem and we need to do something. And really the only thing you're going to be able to do is help raise her to love who she is and what she looks like, and not to judge others by how they look or what they like to look at.

[>Mojave_Gary<]

First of all, sex sales and racism does not (unless your a member of the KKK) Ever heard of comparing apples and oranges?

Second, if you want to take your ethical stance against this type of advertising to the highest level, stop purchasing commodities from companies that use sex to sell their products. I think you will find that a bit difficult, albeit possible.

Third, although I do appreciate your dedication to defending your individual feelings about this subject, I think you are forgetting the fact that, most of what has been said here by myself and others is simply in jest.

And finally, those who's honor you are so aggressively and inadvertantly defending (the REAL women who allow themselves to be exploited in support of the great American tradition of capitalism), would probably be the first to tell you that they are more than happy to cash those paychecks.
Of course that does not make me feel any better about those men who do allow themselves to be controlled by their libidos, but if you were nearly as intelligent, intuitive and evolved as you apparently think you are, you would know the difference between admiring a pair of tits and running out to purchase the over-priced product that is using the over-sized breasts to trigger some over-active libido into spending money. Maybe you should stuff your tongue in your cheek, grow a sense of humor and stop trying to convince everyone else that you are morally superior. I am the first to defend any person's right to make the choices they wish to make. As far as defending sexism, who are you to say just what exactly sexism is anyway? Have you not noticed the 'women-only' clubs where men take off there clothes and shake their asses in support of their 'American dream'? This is America. We live in a capitalist, self-serving environment. Get used to it. Oh and, by the way, how the hell do you equate a scantilly clad woman in an advertisement to pornography anyway?

[Electricide]

*in before lock*

if cartoon porn depicted real life and easily attainable standards, then it wouldn't be fetished would it?

[chris harris]

How is getting turned on by "cartoon porn" (however we're defining it) any more about being a "slave to horniness" than any other fetish? Or any other form of erotica/porn--since it's ALL an artificial construct? Man, that's narrowminded. I don't get turned on by pregnant chicks or clowns or really skinny girls or shit-tons of piercings, but I don't look down on those who do. Everyone's got their thing. If you're really concerned about your niece growing up in a world with narrow standards of beauty, you're already one step behind on that.

my standard is that it merely be a real human being that turns me on. I'm not setting some narrow standard of beauty.

Anyway, having a hang-up about what other people find sexy is one issue, which I can't help you with. As far as your niece, and other young women (and men) around the world, yes--it is a problem and we need to do something. And really the only thing you're going to be able to do is help raise her to love who she is and what she looks like, and not to judge others by how they look or what they like to look at.

sheesh... I'm talking about sexualizing cartoons for crying out loud. I'm not criticizing anyone for WHO they are turned on by. What consenting (human) adults do in private is their own business. I'm just saying that it's my opinion that being turned on by something that you know isn't even human, is pretty weird. If I'm considered narrow-minded because I think that it's idiotic or pathetic to jerk off to some cartoon or computer generated erotica, then so be it. I'm intolerant of cartoon fuckers. Sorry.

[JGriffin]

How is getting turned on by "cartoon porn" (however we're defining it) any more about being a "slave to horniness" than any other fetish? Or any other form of erotica/porn--since it's ALL an artificial construct? Man, that's narrowminded. I don't get turned on by pregnant chicks or clowns or really skinny girls or shit-tons of piercings, but I don't look down on those who do. Everyone's got their thing. If you're really concerned about your niece growing up in a world with narrow standards of beauty, you're already one step behind on that.

my standard is that it merely be a real human being that turns me on. I'm not setting some narrow standard of beauty.

Anyway, having a hang-up about what other people find sexy is one issue, which I can't help you with. As far as your niece, and other young women (and men) around the world, yes--it is a problem and we need to do something. And really the only thing you're going to be able to do is help raise her to love who she is and what she looks like, and not to judge others by how they look or what they like to look at.

sheesh... I'm talking about sexualizing cartoons for crying out loud. I'm not criticizing anyone for WHO they are turned on by. What consenting (human) adults do in private is their own business. I'm just saying that it's my opinion that being turned on by something that you know isn't even human, is pretty weird. If I'm considered narrow-minded because I think that it's idiotic or pathetic to jerk off to some cartoon or computer generated erotica, then so be it. I'm intolerant of cartoon fuckers. Sorry.

How about a painting? Can one jerk off to a painting of a nude woman without you thinking they're pathetic and strange? A statue? A photograph isn't a real human, it's a representation of a human. A cartoon representation of a human is no less artificial than a photo or a quicktime movie. It seems a very arbitrary distinction.

[chris harris]

First of all, sex sales and racism does not (unless your a member of the KKK) Ever heard of comparing apples and oranges?

Sex sells. It's true. So much so that it doesn't even have to be real people. Caricatures of sex can apparently sell, too. Because sex is a good marketing tool, is that reason to suggest that sexism isn't a big deal? Because that's what you're doing.

Second, if you want to take your ethical stance against this type of advertising to the highest level, stop purchasing commodities from companies that use sex to sell their products. I think you will find that a bit difficult, albeit possible.

Believe me. I don't just posture on message boards. I walk the walk.
I'm not even opposed to the idea that "sex sells". I get it. But, my intelligence is offended when they try to sell me something using an obviously fabricated, extremely exaggerated version of what sexy is supposed to be.

Third, although I do appreciate your dedication to defending your individual feelings about this subject, I think you are forgetting the fact that, most of what has been said here by myself and others is simply in jest.

I recognize that. I'm just wondering is sexism funny? You're treating it like that.

And finally, those who's honor you are so aggressively and inadvertantly defending (the REAL women who allow themselves to be exploited in support of the great American tradition of capitalism), would probably be the first to tell you that they are more than happy to cash those paychecks.

Obviously, men aren't the only people to blame for the lack of respect that women (still) get.

Of course that does not make me feel any better about those men who do allow themselves to be controlled by their libidos, but if you were nearly as intelligent, intuitive and evolved as you apparently think you are, you would know the difference between admiring a pair of tits and running out to purchase the over-priced product that is using the over-sized breasts to trigger some over-active libido into spending money. Maybe you should stuff your tongue in your cheek, grow a sense of humor and stop trying to convince everyone else that you are morally superior.

I have quite a sense of humor. In the midst of trying to make a few points, I've taken several opportunities to poke fun at you. And, apparently it's rubbing you wrong. Maybe our senses of humor are incompatible? tragic. But, I just don't think that there are a lot of good jokes to be made about exploiting women. Well, there are, as was pointed out earlier in the comment about the Simpsons. But, jokes that appear to (pretty aggressively, yourself) defend sexism just aren't that funny.

I am the first to defend any person's right to make the choices they wish to make. As far as defending sexism, who are you to say just what exactly sexism is anyway? Have you not noticed the 'women-only' clubs where men take off there clothes and shake their asses in support of their 'American dream'? This is America. We live in a capitalist, self-serving environment. Get used to it. Oh and, by the way, how the hell do you equate a scantilly clad woman in an advertisement to pornography anyway?

I don't. But, the "computer generated erotica" that was linked to is certainly not for children. And, I see that you are the one making the "that's how it is, get used to it" argument. Fortunately, society will continue to evolve IN SPITE of bullshit attitudes like that.

[chris harris]

How about a painting? Can one jerk off to a painting of a nude woman without you thinking they're pathetic and strange? A statue? A photograph isn't a real human, it's a representation of a human. A cartoon representation of a human is no less artificial than a photo or a quicktime movie. It seems a very arbitrary distinction.

I guess it is a pretty arbitrary distinction.
In 2008, I'd consider it a little strange to jerk off to a painting or a statue.
I'd argue that a cartoon is quite a bit more artificial than a photo or video of an actual human.

Again, this is my opinion, and a bit unrelated to the topic here...

I'm not saying that you ARE weird if you jerk off to cartoons.
I'm just saying that I THINK YOU'RE WEIRD if you jerk off to cartoons.

Nobody should be worried about living up to my standards of what is appropriate kinky sex. But, we should be worried about creating a (LITERALLY) unrealistic standard for beauty in our culture.

[>Mojave_Gary<]

Fortunately, society will continue to evolve IN SPITE of bullshit attitudes like that.

Apparently not.