mic-ing drums with only 2 mics...

[leigh]

so what do you do with a fig 8 to project each lobe of the polar pattern into one side of the stereo sphere?

hang on - now i remember - you dont have to split and pan the fig8! the fig8 panned dead centre actually still provides a level of spacial information, doesn't it?

No, panned dead center, any single channel of audio creates a mono output.

"Spacial information" is kind of a loose term - a figure 8 panned dead center doesn't have any stereo spread, since it's mono just like any single channel. You could say that a fig8 has spacial information if it was positioned "sideways", as in an MS configuration, but "sideways" only means something in relation to a second sound source. In MS, there's the other channel (front/center/mono) that establishes the center signal. A fig8 added to that provides "spacial information", because it's looking sideways in relation to that baseline center signal.

Leigh

[timmcallister]

I can only devote 2 mics for drums. i'm planning on using a SDC pair in an XY pattern on the drums. and i'll try to configure the room to give the maximum separation, of course.

is there a different approach that I might try also?

I have no shortage of tracks, but ended up doing the drums on my bands most recent album with 2 mics.

I wanted to get back to a more vintage drum sound. I used two mics (a Coles 4038 and a KSM32). We used the Coles for the primary mic. It took us an hour of playing with placement of this mic to get a good balance of drums, and we ended up placing it over the drummers right shoulder. We got a fantastic balance and the drums were thunderous.

Then I put a KSM32 in an adjacent room (about 25x25) for ambience and left the doors between the rooms open.

I put a safety mic on the kick and snare, but did NOT use them during mix down.

I panned the coles at 11, the KSM at 3. The Coles was about 80% of the sound with the KSM about 20%. The drums sound awesome.

Of course the rooms and drums need to sound good...

[logancircle]

You probably want something in front of the kick that will function as a combined kick/oh/room and then listen to what's missing. You might need to augment that with snare top, snare bottom, mono overhead, room, or something else depending on lots of variables. In front of the kick is a great starting point.

[Derrick]

I put a safety mic on the kick and snare, but did NOT use them during mix down.

I panned the coles at 11, the KSM at 3. The Coles was about 80% of the sound with the KSM about 20%. The drums sound awesome.

Nice. So I have been trying this approach as well, but theoverhead doesn't seem to be enough to capture the snare. But it could be that I just need to move my mic around from the usual "above the kit postion"... how about the kick though? How can you be getting the bottom and punch of the kick from just a room and over the shoulder mic??

[lyman]

I can only devote 2 mics for drums. i'm planning on using a SDC pair in an XY pattern on the drums. and i'll try to configure the room to give the maximum separation, of course.

is there a different approach that I might try also?

I wanted to get back to a more vintage drum sound. I used two mics (a Coles 4038 and a KSM32). We used the Coles for the primary mic. It took us an hour of playing with placement of this mic to get a good balance of drums, and we ended up placing it over the drummers right shoulder. We got a fantastic balance and the drums were thunderous.

Then I put a KSM32 in an adjacent room (about 25x25) for ambience and left the doors between the rooms open.

I put a safety mic on the kick and snare, but did NOT use them during mix down.

...

hey, this thread is still kicking around, cool! i haven't had the chance to try out some of the different suggestions you guys made due to schedule delays, the holidays, etc. But I'm probably going to end up with a SDC (an MC-012) overhead and a LDC out in front of the kick.

timmcallister- what type of mic is that Coles you're talking about? sorry, i'm not familiar with it. and why did you use a safety mic? just in case the sound wasn't happening and you'd have another option?

[timmcallister]

Nice. So I have been trying this approach as well, but theoverhead doesn't seem to be enough to capture the snare. But it could be that I just need to move my mic around from the usual "above the kit postion"... how about the kick though? How can you be getting the bottom and punch of the kick from just a room and over the shoulder mic??

I did have "safety mics" on the snare (57) and kick (RE20), but didn't use them in the mix.

It DOES depend a lot on the drummer, who must "mix" the volume of the drums with their playing. In other words, my drummer was smaking that snare! If the drummer doesn't do this, you probably need more mics, so you can mix the volumes.

The coles has a fantastic bottom end, and as we moved it throughout the room, we often had *too much* kick.

[timmcallister]

hey, this thread is still kicking around, cool! i haven't had the chance to try out some of the different suggestions you guys made due to schedule delays, the holidays, etc. But I'm probably going to end up with a SDC (an MC-012) overhead and a LDC out in front of the kick.

timmcallister- what type of mic is that Coles you're talking about? sorry, i'm not familiar with it. and why did you use a safety mic? just in case the sound wasn't happening and you'd have another option?

I was using the Coles 4038.

Yes - I had safety mics on in case we got to the mix and found we needed more kick or snare.

BTW - I have two shinybox 23c's coming today. I'm looking forward to seeing how they match up to the coles (with the coles being a $1200 mic).

[Ben Logan]

Of course the rooms and drums need to sound good...

No fair.

[timmcallister]

The coles has a fantastic bottom end, and as we moved it throughout the room, we often had *too much* kick.

And OF COURSE, this also depends on the drums "sound" you are after. We wanted an older sound harking back to the 40s/50s (The band plays vintage blues/swing/R&B)

if i were after a "modern" sound, it would be tough to achieve with 2 mics. I probably would have used the kick and snare mic if thats what I were after.

YMMV