Final Destination: 7" 45rpm

[megajoe]

A friend and I having been planning on starting a boutique all-vinyl record label for quite some time now. Our first releases are going to be a series of 7" splits. My friend has all the financial backing for this, all he is willing to spare no expense for a top quality product. To contribute I have offered to engineer any recording that we will release for free (my friend will be paying the studio rates) and do research for the manufacturing of the product.

We are now getting to the point where I'll be recording the first bands in a few months. I have a Studer A-800 at the studio I work at, which seems to be the obvious choice over an HD|3 system. All the bands on the label will be regular touring bands, so recording live to tape shouldn't be a big deal.

Should I go 100% analog all the way? What about mixing to aiff files on a 24/96 CDr or to a 1/4"? Do most record pressing companies have a preference?

Here's a question: When you send a 2-track to get pressed, should you have it mastered the same way you would a CD (while considering the physical limitations of vinyl) or so should it just be the final mix and let the guy putting it on the master lacquer take care of dynamics and EQ?

If you have any other advice, please share!

[scott macdonald]

You may have already read these, but ...

http://www.unitedrecordpressing.com/tips.html

http://www.chicagomasteringservice.com/vinyl.html

-scott

[Cellotron]

I've also posted a number of suggestions for mixing for vinyl release here:
http://www.totalsonic.net/vinyl.htm

Should I go 100% analog all the way? What about mixing to aiff files on a 24/96 CDr or to a 1/4"? Do most record pressing companies have a preference?

Many cutting houses still prefer to get CD-R audio or DAT out of a preference of work flow over fidelity - but the better vinyl mastering facilities have the ability to cut from hi-res digital or do fully analog tranfers. Paul Gold here in Greenpoint Brooklyn at Salt Mastering is one such place that can do both - http://www.saltmastering.com

Best regards,
Steve Berson

[drumsound]

Especially since you're doing split singles and a true A/B path won't be needed for sequencing I'd without a doubt deliver analog 1/4" or 1/2" to the mastering house.

Most places cutting vinyl don't have a true A/B path and thus the reason most vinyl LP masters are cut from (hopefully hi rez) digital masters.

[Cellotron]

Most places cutting vinyl don't have a true A/B path and thus the reason most vinyl LP masters are cut from (hopefully hi rez) digital masters.

Hate to say it - but most vinyl masters these days are cut from 16bit 44.1kHz sources. When I was cutting vinyl at Europadisk the vast majority of sources came in as CD-R Audio - I would receive 24bit files or 16bit/48kHz files once in a blue moon - and received 88.2 and 96kHz files about 5 times in a course of 2 years. And even though we had the capabilities to a pure analog transfer - no one ever asked us to do one!

Best regards,
Steve Berson

[megajoe]

I've read the URP link before, but not the others, thanks.

These are all going to be short run (200-300 each for the 7" series) so I think we'll wait until a full length 12" to drop coin on a 100% analog session.

[drumsound]

Most places cutting vinyl don't have a true A/B path and thus the reason most vinyl LP masters are cut from (hopefully hi rez) digital masters.

Hate to say it - but most vinyl masters these days are cut from 16bit 44.1kHz sources. When I was cutting vinyl at Europadisk the vast majority of sources came in as CD-R Audio - I would receive 24bit files or 16bit/48kHz files once in a blue moon - and received 88.2 and 96kHz files about 5 times in a course of 2 years. And even though we had the capabilities to a pure analog transfer - no one ever asked us to do one!

Best regards,
Steve Berson
Steve Berson

Paul Gold told me the same thing about hi rez about a year and a half ago. He is doing straight analog cuts on occasion though.

[trodden]

I've read the URP link before, but not the others, thanks.

These are all going to be short run (200-300 each for the 7" series) so I think we'll wait until a full length 12" to drop coin on a 100% analog session.

what studio in larrytown you working in? did blacklodge (i guess its technically in Eudora) get a studer?

[JohnDavisNYC]

do not use URP no matter what. they are going out of business and doing REALLY REALLY REALLY shitty work. my band just had to send back 500 records that were unplayably warped from being pulled off the press without cooling, and that was after having to pay out of pocket to have new masters cut my Joe Lambert at TruTone after URP did a terrible job transferring my mixes... totally too loud, thin, and all the sibilants totally blown out... totally shitty job. and they tried to make up excuses each time that put the blame on someone else.

use a good pressing company.

john

[Cellotron]

do not use URP no matter what. they are going out of business

John -
Where have you heard that from? I've been hearing that they were in fact pretty busy and looking to maybe even possibly aquire a few more presses.

If they do go under it would be a major blow to the USA's vinyl record production capacity as they're among the larger plants these days - and certainly one of the largest in the US other than a some of the plants in California. Considering that Hub Servall in New Jersey recently closed - and that Universal, 33-1/3 (the former WEA plant), Acme in Canada, and Europadisk have closed in the past few years - more attrition doesn't bode too well for those wanting to release vinyl but need it at a competitive price. (Then again oil at $97/barrel doesn't help the cause much either)

and doing REALLY REALLY REALLY shitty work. my band just had to send back 500 records that were unplayably warped from being pulled off the press without cooling,

I've always felt URP's pressing quality was pretty mediocre - but I'm sorry to hear you had to deal with this. Unfortunately these issues can indeed come up - hopefully they will back up their product and repress to give you good records asap.

and that was after having to pay out of pocket to have new masters cut by Joe Lambert at TruTone after URP did a terrible job transferring my mixes...

Yeah - I've been pretty unimpressed by the cuts I've heard from whoever URP uses for their "in house" mastering - so getting the vinyl mastering done by an outside studio that really does great work - and better yet - getting the plating (i.e. fathers, mothers, stampers) done at an outside facility that does quality work, like Mastercraft in New Jersey - can really help the ultimate quality of your records.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

[megajoe]

any other companies I should avoid/look into?

[fossiltooth]

I can also vouch for Joe Lambert at Trutone. I used to work there for a little while, although not as an ME. Joe knows what he's doing, and from what I've seen, he always acted truly concerned about each project that came through the door. They're not the cheapest guys out there, but they're definitely affordable and tend to get things done right the first time around.

Tell Adrianna I say hi. She's such a nut!

[megajoe]

I've read the URP link before, but not the others, thanks.

These are all going to be short run (200-300 each for the 7" series) so I think we'll wait until a full length 12" to drop coin on a 100% analog session.

what studio in larrytown you working in? did blacklodge (i guess its technically in Eudora) get a studer?

Naw, they're using an Atr80 out there. I'm working at Daybreak Recording. Interesting fact about our Studer: It used to be Willie Nelson's and was acquired after he went bankrupt.

[trodden]

I've read the URP link before, but not the others, thanks.

These are all going to be short run (200-300 each for the 7" series) so I think we'll wait until a full length 12" to drop coin on a 100% analog session.

what studio in larrytown you working in? did blacklodge (i guess its technically in Eudora) get a studer?

Naw, they're using an Atr80 out there. I'm working at Daybreak Recording. Interesting fact about our Studer: It used to be Willie Nelson's and was acquired after he went bankrupt.

Holy crap, a SSL in Lawrence, Kansas. on Mass street, is that the old Z'Gwonth studio... no you're at 19th and mass, Z'Gwonth was downtown.. Cool. I worked at Sixth Sense Studios, a small home studio, in the late 90's. The only places i remember at the time being RedHouse/BlackLodge, Mercy, Z'Gwonth and cool little 8 track analog room next to that cool used music shop in the alley off mass.

If URP is "United", yeah, their quality is really hit or miss. As Steve mentioned, getting is mastered and plated from an outside source will get you a better pressing, one of the better sounding 7" we've put out was done that route. We went through Pirates Press for our last full length. They use some plant in the Czech Republic, can't think of it right now... but they do 7" as well.

[Cellotron]

If URP is "United", yeah, their quality is really hit or miss.

Yup, United Record Pressing = URP

As Steve mentioned, getting is mastered and plated from an outside source will get you a better pressing, one of the better sounding 7" we've put out was done that route. We went through Pirates Press for our last full length. They use some plant in the Czech Republic, can't think of it right now... but they do 7" as well.

The one in Czech is GZ - http://www.gzvinyl.cz/

Best regards,
Steve Berson