Dither if I'm bouncing tracks to an out of box CD recorder?

[chad_strung]

I am choosing not to mix down my tracks using the "Bounce to Disc" function pro tools offers. I've had some annoying things happen with it, though i've figured out how to use it without getting the "bounce cannot handle etc..." warning (i.e. consolidate edit spots in edit window, convert after bounce, etc...). I have a line going from Analog outputs 1 and 2 to a Phillips CD recorder. It's reliable, and it feels a bit more old school. One day i hope to get my Teac quarter inch two track machine running, and send the mixes to it as a mixdown, to give it some natural tape compression, and warmth. But until then, this is what i'm doing.

Should use a dither on my master fader when doing this? Some tracks were recorded at 48, some at 44.1...

What exactly does the dither help with?

And while we're at it, talking about mixdowns, my band mates think it sounds the best to also compress the stereo tracks going to the CD recorder, gives it a finishing their ears take a liking too, but isn't that a step usually taken in the Mastering phase of an album?

[J.B.Horns]

No, you don't need to dither if you're using the analog outputs. Dither is used when you're going from a higher bit depth to a lower bit depth in the digital realm. I don't know all the technical jargon, but essentially, chopping off the extra bits results in less than ideal circumstances. Somehow, by adding noise (dither) those circumstances are improved.

[J.B.Horns]

And while we're at it, talking about mixdowns, my band mates think it sounds the best to also compress the stereo tracks going to the CD recorder, gives it a finishing their ears take a liking too, but isn't that a step usually taken in the Mastering phase of an album?

If you're going to get it professionally mastered, I would say leave the compressor out of it. On the other hand, it is becoming more and more popular to squash the mixes before handing it over to ME. I know Tchad Blake does it. It doesn't leave as much room for them to do their thing and I know most of them hate that. If you want to send the ME a version of each, I don't think it would hurt.

[chad_strung]

bUT JB, if my session is 24bit at 48, and the CD is going to be 16bit at 44.1, am i not then changing the rate? Or because its going through RCA cables to the CD recorder, the sound is more like an instrument, not really in it's digital form...?

As far as the compression on the master fader, it's a good idea to make two mixes of everything, one for the sake of my bandmates, compressed, so they can hear it in relation to how they hear most other music, squashed, and then another mix of the song without compression in case this album does get a budget and get's sent to a mastering studio!

[J.B.Horns]

bUT JB, if my session is 24bit at 48, and the CD is going to be 16bit at 44.1, am i not then changing the rate? Or because its going through RCA cables to the CD recorder, the sound is more like an instrument, not really in it's digital form...?

As far as the compression on the master fader, it's a good idea to make two mixes of everything, one for the sake of my bandmates, compressed, so they can hear it in relation to how they hear most other music, squashed, and then another mix of the song without compression in case this album does get a budget and get's sent to a mastering studio!

The way I understand it, and it's completely possible that I'm wrong, you don't need to dither when you're using the analog outputs, since there's no truncation going on. The 24 bit audio is passed through the converters, becoming an analog signal, then re sampled as 16 bit by the converters on the CD burner, instead of the extra bits simply being left (or chopped) off by the software.

I agree with making two mixes, one with compression, and one without. The one with compression is going to be a lot "funner" for everyone to hear in the car, at home, on their iPod etc. If and when you decide to have it mastered, the ME will most likely prefer it uncompressed.

[ashcat_lt]

The way I understand it, and it's completely possible that I'm wrong...

You're not wrong.

[chad_strung]

ok, awesome, that's the way i've been doing my mixes for the past couple of weeks since the bounce handler could not keep up with the song, etc... It's sounding pretty good.