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DupleMeter
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Post by DupleMeter » Sun Mar 15, 2009 5:18 am

agauchede wrote:I find omnis can be useful in less than desirable rooms, since there is less build-up of off axis coloration. Of course, if the room is too small to get the mics away from the walls or ceiling, you can also have comb-filtering issues. Get there early if possible -- classical musicians frequently rehearse a few hours before a performance.

Chris
In my experience off-axis coloration is only an issue when using mics that have a discernible off-axis coloration. Any good directional mics will have minimal off-axis coloration and be fine in a near-coincident pair.

Case-in-point: I recorded this piece using an ORTF pair in a room that was basically a large shoebox (long and narrow). The room had a distinct low-end rise with a very long RT60 (over 3 seconds) that made almost anything in it mush. But since the near coincident pairs are good at minimizing room sound this recording came out quite well despite all that.

On the other hand, this piece was recorded in a nice sounding room with an ORTF main pair and omni flanks. A noticeable improvement in fullness.

I also have an admitted bias to keeping my main pair near-coincident. The stereo field is more accurate. Omnis tend to be a bit indiscriminate when it comes to rendering the sound stage accurately. Though, I will use an omni main pair when I have to use spots...since the lack of pin-point stereo imaging works to my advantage when mixing in the spots.

Again - this is all my take on it after 9+ years of mostly classical & trad. jazz minimal mic recordings. I've road tested it and it works consistently for me...which is huge when you're doing live location work. You want a repeatable process that yields good results. You usually don't get a chance for a do-over in these situations.

2leftears
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Post by 2leftears » Mon Mar 16, 2009 11:39 am

If you have room, try a trick from Thad Jones/Mel Lewis where they would put every section in a circle,(sax,trpts, bones & rhythm), a put an omni in the middle of each circle. The idea was to saturate each mic to keep sound from the other sections from bleeding in. It worked quite well back in the day.

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DupleMeter
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Post by DupleMeter » Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:04 pm

2leftears wrote:If you have room, try a trick from Thad Jones/Mel Lewis where they would put every section in a circle,(sax,trpts, bones & rhythm), a put an omni in the middle of each circle. The idea was to saturate each mic to keep sound from the other sections from bleeding in. It worked quite well back in the day.
Now that's a great idea. I hadn't heard that before. The unfortunate reality is that most of my recordings are also public performances, so I have little choice in the group's setup arrangement.

The next time I have the opportunity I will try that technique.

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Bill @ Irie Lab
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Post by Bill @ Irie Lab » Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:32 pm

Contracts are in the mail.

I can't thank you folks enough for the confidence you've given me.

Still nervous; but more and more it's the good kind!

I'll have the freedom to experiment with various techniques (for the first few sessions anyway) but now my toolbox has a few more drawers.

Cheers

Bill
I&TC - Intonation and Technology Company
Irie Lab Sound Studios

***** Sound Science & Soul *****

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jmiller
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Post by jmiller » Fri Mar 27, 2009 12:49 pm

cgarges wrote:
@?,*???&? wrote:Mid-Side I'd say never- at least not for classical music.
Really? I've had great luck doing classical stuff in MS. Then again, I don't have a Decca tree bar.
I know of at least one very major scoring mixer who prefers an m/s mic in conjunction with 2 wide room mics, and hates Decca trees ("they shrink the orchestra" are his words). That and very few, methodically placed spot mics.

But, this is in a large room and wouldn't apply well in this case.

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Bill @ Irie Lab
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Post by Bill @ Irie Lab » Tue May 12, 2009 8:27 am

Here's how the first session went:

The band was arranged to face conductor and clinician with no room for my desk, more importantly, my mics. Presence of a film crew complicated matters by further limiting my choice of setup spot. There was no score available to me.

I found space behind and to the left (from conductor perspective) with the mic tree about 15 feet behind.

Ceiling ~ 12 feet with mics 2/3rd of that height. Configuration was a custom tree with SDCs about head width apart splayed outward at an 80 degree included angle. By listening to tune up this was best to keep the widely spread musicians relatively on-axis.

Not ideal, but it was a balance and sound stage I could live with.

Not five minutes before clinic starts 5 tympanis and a mess of mallet percussion set up between me and the rest of the orchestra!

Deep breath and repeat the mantra - "Successfully dealing with the unexpected is the mark of a professional" "Successfully dealing ..."

Well gentle reader, with a heavily horn -laden orchestral band in an under-sized room the tympani crescendos were only 3 -4 dB above the blat of the horns.

It came out freakin' nice, the client was very pleased, and I'll live to record another day.

Thanks again for the help!

Bill
I&TC - Intonation and Technology Company
Irie Lab Sound Studios

***** Sound Science & Soul *****

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