Make midi piano sound real

[Matthew_Moore79]

I'm using logic studio 9 and trying to get my midi piano to sound as real as possible. Besides using space designer reverb and a little EQ-ing, what else can i do. Is there a specific reverb setting that seems to sound the best for piano? I know that piano is very specific to the user, so i'll go ahead and say that I am going for a huge full sound.

Typically using the Steinway hall voice.

Thanks,

-Matt

[Nick Sevilla]

I'm using logic studio 9 and trying to get my midi piano to sound as real as possible. Besides using space designer reverb and a little EQ-ing, what else can i do. Is there a specific reverb setting that seems to sound the best for piano? I know that piano is very specific to the user, so i'll go ahead and say that I am going for a huge full sound.

Typically using the Steinway hall voice.

Thanks,

-Matt

Hi,

1.- Use a weighted keyboard controller. Fully weighted, just like a real piano. This will force the player to play it more like the real thing.

2.- Use better samples. Yes, this takes money, but there are several piano only sample products out there, simply because it is very hard to properly replicate a piano with sampler. It has too many variances that have to be sampled independently.

3.- Use a simple ambience reverb, a short one, and also a larger one. The short one will replicate the stage reflections, the larger one is for the ambience of the whole theater. You should probably pick up a couple of cheap classical piano solo CDs from your local store. Usually the better ones are Eastern European players playing Mozart, Rachmaninov, etc. Try to match the ambience from these recordings as closely as possible.

Cheers

[A.David.MacKinnon]

+1 on getting better samples. I find combining a few sample sets can help as well.

Other than that it's an uphill battle.
Play the midi piano trough speakers into a good sounding room and mic the result. Try a couple of reverbs together. Try a short delay too.

[plurgid]

here's what I like doing, don't know if it makes it sound "more real", but it does make the default logic 9 steinway samples more interesting ...

create an aux track to use for the reverb and use a send from the piano track to feed it. Place a sample delay plugin ahead of the space designer plugin on the aux, and delay only one channel (left or right). Also set a multipressor plugin after the space designer plugin ...

tweek the send level, sample delay, space designer and multipressor settings to taste. I'm partial to the "hot air baloon" setting on space designer and the "hyped multiband" setting on multipressor, myself.

[wren]

I find combining a few sample sets can help as well.

Yeah, I'm not sure this is what you meant, but I've found that layering a couple different-sounding virtual pianos (both being triggered by the same keyboard/MIDI sequence) really helps a lot.

[A.David.MacKinnon]

I find combining a few sample sets can help as well.

Yeah, I'm not sure this is what you meant, but I've found that layering a couple different-sounding virtual pianos (both being triggered by the same keyboard/MIDI sequence) really helps a lot.

That's what I was talking about. I'll often pair a dark sounding set with a bright one. It tricks your brain into thinking you're hearing more overtones and resonance.

[rushofblood]

I really like the Abbey Road keyboards refill for reason

[Dakota]

I find combining a few sample sets can help as well.

Yeah, I'm not sure this is what you meant, but I've found that layering a couple different-sounding virtual pianos (both being triggered by the same keyboard/MIDI sequence) really helps a lot.

That's what I was talking about. I'll often pair a dark sounding set with a bright one. It tricks your brain into thinking you're hearing more overtones and resonance.

+4: definitely layer multiple sets.

Re: midi and velocity, definitely milk maximum dynamics from soft to loud. Perhaps even edit the midi to intensify the dynamic range. For god's sake do not quantize to a grid! Although neatening up a few bum notes is ok.

Add: PSP pianoverb used judiciously for extra resonance and overtones.

Re-amping into real rooms.

Another thing that may help, if you can blend it in carefully enough to hide it: pitch shifted version a few cents up and down, roll some highs off it so as not to give it away.

Use "stretch tuned" sample sets if you have them. Real pianos generally are tuned increasingly slightly flat toward the lows, increasingly slightly sharp toward the high notes.

[Jim Williams]

I use a Kurzweil Micro Piano module. I paid $299 for it new. It does have excellent samples. The converter is pretty good too. I rebuilt it internally. I rebuilt the power supply and all analog circuits. The low pass filter was redone with a bessel linear phase design. The coupling caps are exotics like Infinicaps. The opamps are precision low noise high speed Analog Devices chips.

The noise floor is very low and the low end is flat to 2 hz eliminating low frequency phase shift. When I track with it I will add about +3 db at 20k hz. That adds back the air that's lost during samples and reproduction. It adds the life that was sucked out and does sell the piano as sounding very natural and real.

Add a bit of Bricasti M7 and it's a winner. If I want more, it's on to a real piano.

[percussion boy]

2.- Use better samples. Yes, this takes money, but there are several piano only sample products out there, simply because it is very hard to properly replicate a piano with sampler. It has too many variances that have to be sampled independently.

+1

It's actually pretty amazing how good a multisampled piano can sound in a band recording. The $$$ and memory required are worth it.

(From the player's end, it's a different deal though; there's a lot about the process of sitting next to this big resonating box, and feeling the way the keys and strings and pedals interact, that you can't reproduce any other way. But sampled pianos can fill the same sonic role, you just play 'em differently.)

[Ben Logan]

I recommend the "Ships Piano," by Pendle. It's superb. I own Akoustik Piano from Native Instruments, which takes tons of EQ to sounds even close to "real" to my ears. The Ships Piano always sits so well in a mix. It's imperfect. You have to "retune" with the Kontakt Player. But, it never fails to charm me. Check out all Pendle's stuff. I bought them all. He even threw one (or two?) sample sets in for free. The guy is a champ and a pro.

Here's a link, if you're interested:

http://virb.com/dulcitone1884

Oh - I forgot to mention: Pendle's stuff is SUPER affordable.

[Galen Ulrich Elfert]

I recommend the "Ships Piano," by Pendle. It's superb. I own Akoustik Piano from Native Instruments, which takes tons of EQ to sounds even close to "real" to my ears. The Ships Piano always sits so well in a mix. It's imperfect. You have to "retune" with the Kontakt Player. But, it never fails to charm me. Check out all Pendle's stuff. I bought them all. He even threw one (or two?) sample sets in for free. The guy is a champ and a pro.

Here's a link, if you're interested:

http://virb.com/dulcitone1884

Oh - I forgot to mention: Pendle's stuff is SUPER affordable. Smile

Awesome. Thank you for this. Reminds me of when I discovered Massey and Audiodamage. I guarantee you I end up buying all of these.

[casey campbell]

ha ha. here's a funny suggestion...

you could reamp to an amp which feeds a speaker, which in turn is firing towards the sound board of a piano. mic the strings with a brick on the sustain pedal.

of course, if you had a piano to begin with, you probably would not have used midi...unless said piano was out of tune slightly or was in bad shape.

otherwise, this technique is great!

you'll have to play around with speaker and mic placement.

[jgimbel]

Screw MIDI. Try a cat piano.