4 track reel tape recorder

markjazzbassist · Post by **markjazzbassist** » Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:16 am

I'm looking to downsize my current setup (tascam 388) and get a nice 4 track recorder. I want a 70's tape sound so I've been looking at the Teac 3440, 40-4, and a3340s. Im thinking 4 tracks on 1/4" tape will give me a thicker tone than 8 on 1/4. Plus I usually only use 4-5 tracks so I can bounce the last one if I need to.

What are your opinions on the tone and sound of these decks? Any other suggestions (keep in mind I want smaller decks, no washing machine units).

Dominick Costanzo · Post by **Dominick Costanzo** » Fri Dec 23, 2011 5:41 pm

Seems to me you're looking to put on a hair shirt.

No one used 1/4" 4 track for any professional recordings during the '70's.
Most early 70's stuff was 1" 8 track.
By 1974, most professional studios were using 2" 16 track.
Consoles of the time weren't small. A 12 input 4 bus console would be at least 3' wide, not including the patch bay.
If you are trying to get that "'70's thing" happening, you can only hope to emulate it with any thing else but this type of gear.

I spent 7 years (1971 - 1978) using a Teac 3340 for my home studio.
It was all I could afford.
At the time a used 1/2" 4 track Ampex or Scully would set you back a couple of grand. The 3340 cost me $850 new.
I learned to use it and got good stuff out of it.
But during the same time, I worked at professional studios and I knew what I was missing.
No sir, didn't like it.

If you're looking to keep it compact, and are committed to 4 tracks, look for an Otari 5050 1/2" 4 track.
These machines are relatively good sounding, reliable & repairable.
No larger is the Otari 5050 1/2" 8 track. The format is not as robust as 1/2" 4 track, but is still quite usable and of much higher quality than the Teac machines you mention.

standup · Post by **standup** » Fri Dec 23, 2011 6:44 pm

Offhand, to me it sounds like a half-solution. The 388 is compact, but not totally hi-fi. A laptop and an interface is compact, and very hi-fi. If the sound quality is important, and you really want tape, look at 1/2" 4 track, not 1/4". My reaction is this: instead of 1/4" 4 track, stick with the 388 and maximize the sound quality by working with it more, and pretend it's your only option so you just have to get massive quality out of it.

1/2" 4 track is the same track width as 1" 8 track or 2" 16 track, in other words, as good as tape is ever going to sound. If the tape speed is 15 or 30 ips, I guess, and the machine is in good shape.

My efforts with tape were 4 track cassette, 8 track 1/4" reel to reel, 16 track 1/2". In the end, for me, recording to pro tools is easier and gets good results with less hassle.

If you want high quality tape-based sounds, go with 1/2 or 1" tape, I think. But it's not compact the way the 388 is. If compact is the most important thing, you may have it already. If sound quality is the most important thing, go big. Rolling carts full of washing-machine sized goodness,

j.harv · Post by **j.harv** » Sat Dec 24, 2011 4:28 pm

I would stick with the 388.
Dont think I could ever part with mine.

markjazzbassist · Post by **markjazzbassist** » Sat Dec 24, 2011 9:32 pm

I don't want computer already have pro tools, I'm on TAPE OP for a reason, for tape. The 388 isn't compact it's massive, takes up our whole kitchen table, I'm in a small LA apartment. I'm married and music is a side gig now, I quit full time work in August to spend more time with my family.

Also the otari mx5050 I already have the 2 track version and it's nOt 1/2" tape, it's 1/4". For 1/2" otari 4 track it's the mtr, which Is the same size as a washing machine studer or Ampex 2" machine, that won't work.

I think you people are confused, I'm not the foo fighters, I'm not doing "pro" recordings, I'm using a 388 after all right now. Semi pro is great. The 70's vibe is in the electronics which the teac has, the 34b tascam is 80's and too clean sounding.

For size I just need a vertical machine or something, for tape width 4 tracks on 1/4" is better than the 388 in fact it's the same as the mentioned above 8 track 1/2" reels, so why don't people dig it? I'm not looking for a big mixer, I'm going small and I can always bounce if I need to. The 388 is 8 on 1/4" so technically I will be making a big step up, also it's 7.5 ips whereas the teac is 15. Spec wise it looks a LOT better to me. Am I missing something?

E.Bennett · Post by **E.Bennett** » Sun Dec 25, 2011 2:00 pm

Had a teac 2340. It was super cool. Pretty noisy and murky, not sure if that means 70's sounding. You won't notice a drop in sound quality from the 388. I actually prefer the 2340 recordings to the 388 recordings.

donny · Post by **donny** » Sun Dec 25, 2011 4:23 pm

I think I know where you're coming from.

With your specific requirements in mind, the original 3340 (or any of the variations [A-3340, A-3340-S, 3340-S]) would be the best choice -- it has more 'vintage vibe' or whatever you wanna call it. Just keep in mind that the sync response is pretty bad (not 'cool' bad, just bad), so if you're recording more than 4 tracks, you'll have to get more creative.

The 3440 is an updated version and the 40-4 is an updated version of that. Both are easier to use but move toward a cleaner/thinner sound, comparable to the 80-8 ... which essentially means still '70s but I think they use ICs instead of discrete. I agree about the 38, 388 and '80s-era Tascams ... they definitely don't sound as good to me. But the 3440 and 40-4 don't sound like that, they still sound cool. Just not as 'right' to me as the original 3340 ... which admittedly is a pain to use at times.

Another option you might want to consider is your mix deck. Get a 2-track version of the 3340, which is named Teac 3300 and mix to it from your 388. This will get you a similar sound. I recorded an album on an 80-8 and mixed to a 3300 and it sounded kind of 3340-ish. http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/MagicHerovsRockPeople if you wanna hear samples. Kelley Stoltz recorded most of his stuff on a 388 and it sounds pretty legit.

granted, at the end they are all 'tools' and blah blah blah, but there is a distinct inspiration that comes with the 3340 that is lacking on the '80s Tascam stuff for sure.

I use an 80-8 myself but am currently looking to 'upgrade' to a Scully 280 4-track if anyone knows where I can get one.

I'm Painting Again · Post by **I'm Painting Again** » Sun Dec 25, 2011 5:59 pm

now that all these machines are very old..you may only be able to use the model as sort of a broad comparison..individual machines now have sat around in various environments of use and abuse for over 20 years on average..in some cases over 40 years..individual machines is a more precise criteria for comparison though of course much more difficult to actually compare in the real world..so caveat emptor

as the owner of an a3440, otari mx5050-1/2"-8 and an ampex 440b 1/4"-2 slash 1/2"-4 and lots of experience..I'd put my machines in this order..

otari-8 then the a3440-1/4"-4 then the ampex being the most "good" sounding..

lots of great records have been released on the teac decks like for example all the classic flying nun stuff..

donny · Post by **donny** » Sun Dec 25, 2011 6:59 pm

Sheep in Punk Clothing wrote:now that all these machines are very old..you may only be able to use the model as sort of a broad comparison..individual machines now have sat around in various environments of use and abuse for over 20 years on average..in some cases over 40 years..individual machines is a more precise criteria for comparison though of course much more difficult to actually compare in the real world..so caveat emptor

I agree with this to a degree, but I think if a deck is in reasonable working condition, there is a fairly consistent sonic blueprint ... of course there are always variables that are likely more important than the tape machines. Bias, tape type, preamp, room, musicians, etc.

interesting that you rate the 440 last. I have a 440 mono and i think it's kind of in a different league than the Japanese stuff.

Dominick Costanzo · Post by **Dominick Costanzo** » Sun Dec 25, 2011 10:09 pm

Mark, Otari made many variants of the 5050
1/4" 2 track, 1/4" 4 track, 1/2" 4 track and 1/2" 8 track.

The 1/4" 4 track MX5050BQII is the same size as your 2 track.
http://reel2reeltexas.com/vinOtariMX5BQII.jpg

Tascam 44 1/4" 4 track,
http://www.angelfire.com/electronic2/vi ... cam44.html
and Tascam 48 and 58 1/2" 8 track
http://www.torridheatstudios.com/ftp/Sh ... 048-OB.JPG
are also vertically oriented and no bigger than your 5050

All these machines would significantly outperform Teac 3340, 3440 and 40-4.

I have to agree with donny that a properly maintained and set up Ampex 440 will sonically blow away any Japanese tape machine ever made with the possible exception of Otari MTR series.

markjazzbassist · Post by **markjazzbassist** » Sun Dec 25, 2011 11:13 pm

Great points everyone, that's why I love this forum. After thinking it over Ive realized that with only a 4 track I can't get crazy with the panning in the mix, since it's only 4 channels to mix, l r c and other. So im thinking maybe 8 track now.

Otari mx5050
Teac 80-8

80's versus 70's machine, balanced versus unbalanced. Well see what I end up with. Space is my biggest concern though so I'm guessing it'll be the teac 80-8.

E.Bennett · Post by **E.Bennett** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 10:05 am

Always liked the tascam 38

I'm Painting Again · Post by **I'm Painting Again** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 1:22 pm

donny wrote:
interesting that you rate the 440 last. I have a 440 mono and i think it's kind of in a different league than the Japanese stuff.

i'm rating it best..perhaps my wording made it seem in reverse order..

donny · Post by **donny** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 5:00 pm

Sheep in Punk Clothing wrote:
donny wrote:
interesting that you rate the 440 last. I have a 440 mono and i think it's kind of in a different league than the Japanese stuff.
i'm rating it best..perhaps my wording made it seem in reverse order..

ha! we're in 100% agreement then; I would choose the same order.

Brett Siler · Post by **Brett Siler** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 5:37 pm

When I think of a 70's sound generally I think of a dead room and dynamic mics more than anything else. That said you could find an Otari MX5050 4 track for pretty cheap. They might be more neutral sounding than what you are going for but you could always treat your sounds on the way into the recorder to get a more "vintage" sound.

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