Help Mixing Shakers

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Mustang Martigan
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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by Mustang Martigan » Sun Apr 15, 2018 4:42 am

Wow, thanks again for all the suggestions! Some great stuff in here.

I got some free time to work on this song today and try a few things differently. Gonna change the SP1 (LDC) to a SM57 and not close mic. That's all I can do as far as mics go cuz it's all I've got. Well, I have a pair of SP1's.

I might look around my place to find materials for a DIY shaker. That pair of Mexican maracas I mentioned look like they were hastily put together for tourists. I don't know if it's the stuff inside or not enough stuff inside because they sound a bit empty.

When I feel like I've done all I can do, maybe I'll post the song and get some constructive criticism.

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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by Mustang Martigan » Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:46 am

Oh ya, I got a couple more questions..

When you guys say not to drive the preamp, is there a certain dB level I shouldn't go above?

More than one instrument can be classified as a shaker, yes? I'm using these maracas cuz they're all I have. I used to own a mini egg shaker too, but it got lost somewhere along the line.

I know this is the second time I'll be mentioning Street Fighting Man, but I love the shaker sound on that. Besides it being tracked a million times, anyone know what they were using? Could it be several different ones to fill in the sound?

And finally, regarding my initial comment on reverb, I just randomly threw some on thinking that reverb and shaker go hand in hand. From these comments, I was apparently mistaken. The auto pan idea seems interesting, but I dont think I own a plugin for that. I was thinking that the Waves ADT plug might sound cool.

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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by vvv » Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:45 am

Keep the peaks below -12db and you should be aiight.

There's all kinds of idears for makin' shakers above, but for authenticity, try ice cubes inna metal martini mixer.

SFM: I think that was a handful of Keef's used needles inna metal martini mixer. And some of Brian's (he did contrib a little to that record), so, yes.

To reverb or not to reverb? Deep question. It appears you are using a DAW, so you can also draw in the pans - they can be slow, just 1-4 thru a measure, and also fairly shallow, 10:00-2:00, and sound good.
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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by Mustang Martigan » Sun Apr 15, 2018 9:29 am

vvv wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:45 am
Keep the peaks below -12db and you should be aiight.

There's all kinds of idears for makin' shakers above, but for authenticity, try ice cubes inna metal martini mixer.

SFM: I think that was a handful of Keef's used needles inna metal martini mixer. And some of Brian's (he did contrib a little to that record), so, yes.
Haha. Nice.
vvv wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:45 am
To reverb or not to reverb? Deep question. It appears you are using a DAW, so you can also draw in the pans - they can be slow, just 1-4 thru a measure, and also fairly shallow, 10:00-2:00, and sound good.
I hate drawing in automation. Is there some kind of cheap interface you can link up with PT that just has a few knobs and faders for real-time or recorded automation? Even if it was literally just one knob and one fader that you could assign to specific knob/fader in PT. It would make things so much easy and speed up workflow.

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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by Gregg Juke » Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:39 am

The maracas on "SFM" are maracas. One of Mick's many...... "talents."

For a softer/more controlled sound, hold/cup the gourd end, rather than the handle. You will mute the sound, and those tourist maracas break at the handle all the time, so it is likely an eventuality. An egg shaker would be better though, in regards to your desire for less broadband shhhhkraaa in your sound. They are only a couple bucks at the music store.

Posting an example would be great, because until then it's all hypothetical...

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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by vvv » Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:54 am

Gregg Juke wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:39 am
..., because until then it's all hypothetical...
As opposed to hypodermic. :twisted:
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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by drumsound » Sun Apr 15, 2018 3:12 pm

Gregg Juke wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:39 am
The maracas on "SFM" are maracas. One of Mick's many...... "talents."

For a softer/more controlled sound, hold/cup the gourd end, rather than the handle. You will mute the sound, and those tourist maracas break at the handle all the time, so it is likely an eventuality. An egg shaker would be better though, in regards to your desire for less broadband shhhhkraaa in your sound. They are only a couple bucks at the music store.

Posting an example would be great, because until then it's all hypothetical...

GJ
Yeah, maracas are kind of weird instruments. Most people play them with the gourd upright, and as a shaker, but that's not really how they work best. The handle makes them much harder to control on a strict rhythmic part. Holding the gourd, with the handle parallel to the floor makes them more shaker like.

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A.David.MacKinnon
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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by A.David.MacKinnon » Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:51 pm

Gregg Juke wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:39 am
The maracas on "SFM" are maracas. One of Mick's many...... "talents."
Is SFM a Jimmy Miller production? I feel like all the amazing percussion stuff happened on his records. If you watch the footage of Sympathy For The Devil by the end of the film Keith is playing bass and Wyman and Jones are both playing percussion.

I don't think Street Fighting Man is a bunch of maracas. Just a pair mixed really, really, really loud. Like louder than the snare. It's a ballsy move that pays off in a big way.

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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by drumsound » Sun Apr 15, 2018 9:52 pm

A.David.MacKinnon wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:51 pm
Gregg Juke wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:39 am
The maracas on "SFM" are maracas. One of Mick's many...... "talents."
Is SFM a Jimmy Miller production? I feel like all the amazing percussion stuff happened on his records. If you watch the footage of Sympathy For The Devil by the end of the film Keith is playing bass and Wyman and Jones are both playing percussion.

I don't think Street Fighting Man is a bunch of maracas. Just a pair mixed really, really, really loud. Like louder than the snare. It's a ballsy move that pays off in a big way.
Jimmy Miller is all about the percussion. I really want to do a documentary about him.

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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by Mustang Martigan » Mon Apr 16, 2018 5:13 am

A.David.MacKinnon wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:51 pm
I don't think Street Fighting Man is a bunch of maracas. Just a pair mixed really, really, really loud. Like louder than the snare. It's a ballsy move that pays off in a big way.
That's some amazing mixing if it's only one track of maracas . It sounds huge. Or maybe they all got em, playing together.

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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by ubertar » Mon Apr 16, 2018 5:30 am

So long as we're talking about homemade shakers... some of my favorites are tea balls filled with BBs, wrapped in gauze tape and screwed onto drumsticks to be shaker-mallets. That way your shakes are always perfectly timed with your drum strikes.

For recording shakers alone, I do the same as most of you above: ribbons, high pass, low in the mix.
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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by A.David.MacKinnon » Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:23 am

Mustang Martigan wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 5:13 am
A.David.MacKinnon wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:51 pm
I don't think Street Fighting Man is a bunch of maracas. Just a pair mixed really, really, really loud. Like louder than the snare. It's a ballsy move that pays off in a big way.
That's some amazing mixing if it's only one track of maracas . It sounds huge. Or maybe they all got em, playing together.
You've gotta remember that that stuff was all done on 8 track. It might be a few people playing but it'll be one track, probably with other stuff on there too.

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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by vvv » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:59 am

A noteworthy side effect of putting too much thought and effort into mixing shakers is that you become a shaking mixer.

IME, that is.

And the martoonie hangover mighta contributed.

:twisted:
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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by Magnetic Services » Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:25 pm

Wild, wild horses couldn't drag this thread back on topic, but I'm going to try.
Mustang Martigan wrote:
Sun Apr 15, 2018 9:29 am
I hate drawing in automation. Is there some kind of cheap interface you can link up with PT that just has a few knobs and faders for real-time or recorded automation? Even if it was literally just one knob and one fader that you could assign to specific knob/fader in PT. It would make things so much easy and speed up workflow.
Yes there is a device for that: https://www.musicstore.de/en_GB/GBP/Pre ... 006101-000
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Re: Help Mixing Shakers

Post by floid » Mon Apr 16, 2018 1:53 pm

ubertar wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 5:30 am
So long as we're talking about homemade shakers... some of my favorites are tea balls filled with BBs, wrapped in gauze tape and screwed onto drumsticks to be shaker-mallets. That way your shakes are always perfectly timed with your drum strikes.

For recording shakers alone, I do the same as most of you above: ribbons, high pass, low in the mix.
I do something similar with aforementioned shotgun shell.
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