How Proctective Are You Guys...

[MASSIVE Mastering]

I think as long as your communications are clear, there usually isn't an issue. When I send mixes out to be mastered (you don't think I master my own mixes, do you? ) I'm *very* specific with the engineer what I'm looking for as far as volume (or the lack thereof) is concerned.

Scratch that - Not "very" specific - I either tell him that the client wants it pushed or to put it where the mixes *want* to be.

There are a lot of M.E.'s who, unfortunately, are almost "trained" to push the volume from the start. I've been guilty of it myself on more than one occasion. We're so used to "make it as loud as possible" being first on the list that it almost becomes second nature to drive it hard.

[MoreSpaceEcho]

So I think there's this pressure on small-time ME's who deal with mostly indie clients to do something that the client can 'hear.' That's a part of the problem with all of these ridiculous sounding masters you are seeing.

fwiw i haven't found that to be the case. i always try and do as little as possible. people seem to be liking it ok.

i do think there's a lot of small time ME's who *think* they need to do something really dramatic, and have these massive plug in chains with 54 bands of eq and blabla (i'm talking out my ass here, its not like i go around to peoples bedroom mastering setups and peer over their shoulders at what they're doing. but still...)

anyway, this is all kinda off topic to what chris is asking, which is how do you, as the mixer, deal with a shitty mastering job. and i think in most cases, if the band is happy with the mastering then yer outta luck. i know of one example where the mixer thought the master was too bright or whatever, the band trusted him, as he had a good, longstanding relationship with them AND with the ME, it got mastered again and everyone was happy. but i think thats usually not the case...

[joel hamilton]

I try and create mixes that stand up to the next level of hoops they will be asked to jump through....

I also simply try and develop (and have developed) a relationship with a specific group of mastering engineers that I know will fit each type of project i wind up working on... including budget.

[cgarges]

I try and create mixes that stand up to the next level of hoops they will be asked to jump through....

There are some people calling themselves mastering engineers who make those hoops into one giant-ass Slinky. (Jump though that, motherfucker!)

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC

[jayro_rockola]

If you really really care about the mastering of a record you worked on, go to the mastering session. After having to "correct" the mastering engineer about several things on a recent record I did, I don't know If i'll ever trust a mastering engineer to just "do his/her thing" without my input.

[Slider]

I just did a record that came back from mastering REALLY bright, loud as fuck, and pretty distorted.
It bummed me out, but the band actually mentioned how the mastering made it sound so much better, so whatever.
I guess people love the sound of 15k cranked with obscene limiting.

I make suggestions on who I like and hope for the best.
It's a pretty hard thing to control unless you really have that power.
I usually don't.

[MoreSpaceEcho]

15k cranked with obscene limiting.

it hurts my ears just reading that.

[drumsound]

Its a really tough call. I've got a few guys I've worked with that do good jobs and I prefer to send clients to them. On things that I'm really heavily invested in I try to go somewhere I can make the mastering session. I had a band send something to a guy I sometimes like and sometimes don't. I didn't like what was done to that record, but the band really dug it. I thought the pairing would work and it did, to an extent.

[joel hamilton]

I try and create mixes that stand up to the next level of hoops they will be asked to jump through....

There are some people calling themselves mastering engineers who make those hoops into one giant-ass Slinky. (Jump though that, motherfucker!)

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC

LOL.... Awesome.
What I mean is that if the band is willing to go to someone with the "giant ass slinky" even after I suggest like 5 people, with WILDLY varying rates, from totally reasonable to expensive... Then i have to move on and get on with the next project. I know there have been a few "blanks fired" at the world that I have done, and it is not always going to be the best foot forward, but I always accept that it is what it is, and that the record is a document of what we were capable of with the tools/money/time we had. Nothing more nothing less.

[@?,*???&?]

I just finished a mix for a record and the band and I had discussed who would be mastering their project prior to setting to work.

So I get a call from one of the band members last week saying they had just heard something of a friends band that some guy mastered out of his basement and thinks it sounds pretty good and the guy is cheap. He said I should hear it because I'd probably like it. I just about choked on my coffee, then I quickly said, "Nope, ain't gonna happen. It's going to Los Angeles and it's gonna get done right."

I have not heard back from the band. Interesting to note that through the course of overdubbing and mixing this project the band has almost broke up 3 times as well. It's funny, but spending money is a serious gut-check for bands. Some non-moving, non-negotiable rate is a reality check for some.

[???????]

you know what I think about that? Let them learn the hard way. If you will cheap out on your mastering to save a little beer money then you probably don't love it enough to do anything in this business anyway.