When do you use mid-side?

[JWL]

I use M/S for acoustic guitar overdubs a lot, in part because I'm not always sure I'll need mono or stereo tracks in the mix. M/S tracks tend to break down to either with the fewest artifacts, imho.

I also use M/S if I'm recording a full band. I'll set up the band in (more or less) a semicircle, with the performers arranged (more or less) how I'll want the stereo spread to be. I'll then have them adjust volumes etc until it sounds good just with a M/S pair at the apex of the semicircle. Then, I'll also close mic things. When I mix, the M/S pair is both the foundation and the glue that holds things together.

Sometimes I use blumlein in this manner, if I have the band set up in a circle (ie, drums and bass in opposite corners of a room picked up by 1 fig-8, 2 guitarists in the other corners, picked up by the other fig-8).

[drumsound]

I also use M/S if I'm recording a full band. I'll set up the band in (more or less) a semicircle, with the performers arranged (more or less) how I'll want the stereo spread to be. I'll then have them adjust volumes etc until it sounds good just with a M/S pair at the apex of the semicircle. Then, I'll also close mic things. When I mix, the M/S pair is both the foundation and the glue that holds things together.

I did that with an Irish mucis all acoustic group. The M/S pair was great!!!!

[chconnor]

Just for fun, I submit:

"Give You a Word"
http://caseyconnor.org
(go to discography/g-g-g-ghosts?/Give You a Word)

...except for the cajon "kick" and "snare", and for the keyboard, every single track is recorded m/s (all the little shakers, the voice, etc.) It was my "learn about m/s" experiment track.

-c

[bronsonmestizo]

I don't really ever use MS in the studio since it simply decodes to an adjustable XY and I'd just assume setup in XY.
-Jeremy

It isn't really the same.
In XY, your center image is picked up by the degraded, off axis response of the two mics added together (frequency and transient characteristics change when the mics are at an angle).
M-S starts off with one mic (Mid) pointed directly at the instrument/ensemble. It is placed (omni, fig 8, or cardioid) as if it were the only mic in use. The Side mic, though the matrixing can be added as needed to accent the image. The center image is still represented, mostly by the mid mic, which is optimally positioned. If the M-S must be mono-ed later on, you end up with a superior sum of the left-right as compared to the XY option.

Completely agree with gregnrom. This is why it's totally logical to record a vocal with M/S and control the degree of stero spread whereas X/Y would not capture the vocal accurately enough.

Another thought... When I recorded drums for Row Craven, I set up M/S using a km84 mid and royer 121 sides. The ribbon made for more interesting sides, especially when I shelved the highs. When combined with the huge room we were in, it was nothing short of Psychadelic.

[RIFFZILLA]

Ive done m/s on a piano before to get a huge wide sound out of it...but it didnt work as well as hoped. i ended up summing signals and running mono piano.

Mid side is cool but takes a while to manuver into the right position.

[Recycled_Brains]

Just for fun, I submit:

"Give You a Word"
http://caseyconnor.org
(go to discography/g-g-g-ghosts?/Give You a Word)

...except for the cajon "kick" and "snare", and for the keyboard, every single track is recorded m/s (all the little shakers, the voice, etc.) It was my "learn about m/s" experiment track.

-c

This sounds great man. Nice work. I really like the way the MS sounds on your vocals. Is there any reverb on the vocal, or is all the space from the MS set up?

[chconnor]

Hey thanks!

Had to go check it out to remember. There is definitely verb (like 2- or 3-sec verb) on the vocal; it was recorded in a pretty dry room, and i wanted the track to have a kind of dreamy vibe to it. Listening to it in the mix, though, i think it's fair to say that it gets its wider "body" from the mid/side; doesn't seem like the verb is all that audible.

The guitar has nothing on it, though, and i think the m/s sounds really nice there. It's easiest to hear that in the first minute or so.

The chopsticks-on-kitchenware percussion parts at the jam at the end had tremendous spread (a whole array of them spread out on the floor under the mics) but of course that's hard to hear with the million other things going on. Oh wait, you can hear it! At 3:23, in the "bridge".

Right on,
-c

[Joe P.]

I've been using a ghetto m/s setup for drum overheads lately. I've got an apex 205 ribbon as the 'sides' and an EV re-11 as the 'mid.' What it's done is given me three-mics-for-the-price-of two, so to speak. I'm in my garage, naturally a small room, and the setup's given the illusion of being in a larger room. I've been really pleased with the overall sound of it. I've also used it on a tamborine track to good effect.

[thesimulacre]

Just used it yesterday on some "spur-of-the-moment" oohs from a group of four of us. It worked out well because one of us toward the center (I'm not naming any names, Chris) was over-doing it a little.

*Chuckles*

I think the combo was a TLM-something and "old bendy"-- an older Rode that got knocked down by an excitable drummer once and never really looked the same.

[Babaluma]

i use the voxengo msed freeware vst plugin to decode a stereo signal into m/s. i'll then send the m and the s through different modular synth patches, then back into the pc through another instance of the msed to get back to regular stereo. it allows for incredible experimentation, especially of the stereo field as related to frequency etc.

an example here (warning - experimental noise type track, not your regular guitars/drums/bass/keyboards mix, but does include a nice balinese bamboo flute!):

http://darkflame.hermetech.net/Musick/08Maggie.mp3