How do YOU record acoustic guitar with vocals?

[BradG]

When you want to record the acoustic guitar, with the player's vocals, at the same time.

I haven't had to do this one in a while and now, after one such session, I'm remembering that I've never been totally satisfied with the results.

I've tried a vertical x/y and variations on that, as well as very close miking of both (usually dynamics, or a mixed pair). The latter always sounds the worst.

I think my favorite is just to set my 87 in omni (or cardioid maybe) and move it around until the balance is good. That usually sounds the best but, of course, leaves me with a totally mono recording.

[trashy]

leaves me with a totally mono recording.

you say that like it's a bad thing.

[spankenstein]

I've gotten good results with x/y and a single mike that I've moved around. Usually I'll add a stereo pair back quite a ways to add some room.

[kayagum]

If you have a pair of figure 8 mikes, you can do a Blumlein-like setup. For the vocal mic, point the null at the guitar soundhole. For the guitar mic, point the null at the mouth.

[Russian Recording]

Ive done lots of stuff, and have been pretty happy with all results.

It greatly depends on the singing style and playing style. The toughest is a singer that belts but plays the guitar very light, or even finger picked. Fig 8 and hypercard mics can work really well if positioned properly to reject the vox from the gtr mics and visa versa. It can get boomy if you get too close though.

I recently recorded this guy with a very simple setup and it came out really awesome.

LOMO 19A-13 (card) > Hamptone Tube > Distressor (3:1)
about 3 ft away, facing dudes mouth to pick up voice and guitar.

M/S pair for room mics, on the floor in my live room:
Eathworks TC-30K as MID, AT4050 in fig 8 as SIDE > Syteks > Electrical Audi MS Decoder

That was it, and I think it turned out pretty good. Th LOMO is about 90% of the mix. Here is an mp3:

Morrow: Permanence

[drumsound]

I often use an XY pair on the guitar and a fugure 8 on the vocal. I'm more concerned about the vocal being isolated than the guitar. I usually add a stereo room pair as well.

[Eric Rottmayer]

i've done this so many different times and for me it depends on the
situation, guitar, type of song, room, etc. but what i've been doing lately
is the SM7 really close & comped for vocals and a omni (rode K2 tube) for
the acoustic about 2 or 3 feet away (moving it around to find the best spot, like you said).

but i kinda like doing the mono too, same just without the SM7.

sometimes i'll do a take each way and just pick the best one.

[BradG]

I often use an XY pair on the guitar and a fugure 8 on the vocal. I'm more concerned about the vocal being isolated than the guitar. I usually add a stereo room pair as well.

Hmmm. That's one I haven't tried yet. I'm gonna give that a shot on this upcoming recording. Do you group all three mic's tightly to try and get the fig 8 mic on the same "plane" as the x/y's?

[JGriffin]

simply build a horizontally-aligned gobo at chest level between the singer's head and the guitar. Mic each separately. This method provides excellent isolation, though you will need to work quickly as the blood loss from bisecting the performer's body will cause loss of consciousness, but a good performer will be able to overcome this and nail the tune in two takes or less. Any singer not able to do this, you don't want to work with anyway. You'd probably have to autotune them too, and who wants that?

[trashy]

I often use an XY pair on the guitar and a fugure 8 on the vocal. I'm more concerned about the vocal being isolated than the guitar. I usually add a stereo room pair as well.

this sounds like a phase nightmare.

[MoreSpaceEcho]

it does? why for? seems reasonable to me.

last time i did this i used two earthworks tc30s, spaced pair, on the guitar, and two ksm 141s in omni on the floor back a ways. this guy was the loud singer/quiet guitar player type, so i also used an m160 and...something else up close on the guitar. but those two did end up making for all sorts of phase weirdness..it wasn't obviously "phasey" it just didn't end up sounding good. so we just went with the omnis, his voice does overpower the guitar now and again but i gotta say the sound of his voice through the earthworks actually sounds better than any time i've recorded his vox "properly". hhhmmm...

[knobtwirler]

simply build a horizontally-aligned gobo at chest level between the singer's head and the guitar. Mic each separately. This method provides excellent isolation, though you will need to work quickly as the blood loss from bisecting the performer's body will cause loss of consciousness, but a good performer will be able to overcome this and nail the tune in two takes or less. Any singer not able to do this, you don't want to work with anyway. You'd probably have to autotune them too, and who wants that?

Hahaha, I'm picturing some sort of doggie lampshade contraption...

[cgarges]

I usually do a Blumlein thing with the null of each mic pointed at the respective opposing source. I've done a bunch of records this way and have developed a few additional techniques based on what artists have wanted to hear. If the guitar is boomy-sounding with this setup, I might go with a cardioid capsule as the guitar mic. If the guitar isn't loud enough, I'll use an additional guitar mic down near the player's strumming hand and use the hand as a sort of baffle between the mic and the vocal. (I use my line of sight to determine positioning.) Usually, to help out the stereo image (and because I like the way it sounds), I'll use an additional stereo setup as an ambient signal in addition to the close mics. This is usually an X-Y or ORTF pair, often facing away from the source, but occasionally, an MS setup sounds terrific for this. In the mix phase, panning on the close mics can be anywhere, not necessaory mono all the time.

This is what's worked well for me.

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC

[knobtwirler]

Lately I've been a big fan of the guitar being a mono tight rhythmic element if the song calls for it. This would mean one cardioid mic on the body somewhere and one vocal mic. The Blumlein thing sounds really cool. How different of a sound do you get with that? The biggest problem with recording guitar and vox at the same time seems to be movement during playing and extreme volume changes in vocal parts/guitar playing.

[cgarges]

The Blumlein thing sounds really cool. How different of a sound do you get with that?

It's pretty predictable. You get more LF boost from proximity effect due to the nature of bidirectional microphones. The "window of opportunity" as far as player movement is concerned is smaller due to the nature of bidirectional microphones. The plus is that you get more rejection, so there's a little more room for making audible balance adjustments with less phase interferrence due to the coincident arrangement.

The biggest problem with recording guitar and vox at the same time seems to be movement during playing and extreme volume changes in vocal parts/guitar playing.

This doesn't change. It can be problematic in almost any situation where more than one microphone is capturing the same source if that source is A) noticebly dynamic and B) frought with the potential for movement.

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC