ProTools Tempo Mapping, Etc...

[joel hamilton]

"based on your initial tempo marker"

There is always a 120 bpm marker at the beginning of my sessions when I start a new session. I don't mess with it unless the song is tracked live.

this thread was about something that was tracked without grid or a click at all, and how to create a grid based on a performance and have the ability to lock to the "free" performance after the fact.

Yes! exactly what I want to do. I started with this thread because I thought the principles should apply still but I would be using elastic time to adjust the performance AFTER creating a grid.

Scenario>
Let's say the band slowed down during a few bars of a take that was recorded with no click. It feels akward and can't be re-tracked.

a) i want this performance on a grid so I can fix the part. I have grid lines of course but they are at the "120" rate stated earlier because I don't know how to get rid of it
b) i want to speed it up a bit to match the rest of the song so it is more in the pocket. .


Right now i am
a) guessing the tempo manually,
b) splicing up the errant bars into a group
c) placing a tempo marker(of my guessed tempo) at the beginning and end of the group(so the rest of the perfomance doesn't get messed with)

There has to be a better way and I am getting lost on the identify beat command. I think the key is the bar/beat mode or something.

Thanks joel, ps i use my bova ball all the time.

Okay. I get it. it actually IS different, what you are trying to do.
What I was talking about was making a grid from the live performance, so the grid would ALSO slow down where the band slowed down. When it is something that sounds good, then having the grid actually push and pull along with the original drums can be really nice. not always, but sometimes.
You are talking about fixing a section of a song where the band, without a click, rushed or dragged enough that it doesnt sound good to you.
That is a whole different situation.
That requires lots of subjective listening and moving, like you said you are doing. The grid method would sound like poop if you just tried to impose the grid based on the tempo of what? On the couple of measures before the slowdown? on the end of the song?
know what I mean? it is a subjective thing. The grid is just a ruler, and you have to decide where to cut, even with a ruler around. the tape measure doesnt make the cut.
also, you are talking about the "default" tempo, which is 120. yes, that will affect your marker generation. you have to tap tempo and find something close to the part of the song you think is right on, then use the tempo editor or identify beat to change the tempo around... why bother. just edit the song so it feels right to you.

[digitaldrummer]

I just got a bunch of PTLE sessions from a friend that was done to a drum machine and recored on DA-88's. I had trouble finding the exact tempo and it seemed to drift...

so I recorded a "click" track by playing some claves along with the track. Then I took the clave track, used identity beat to set tempo markers. Then (because I'm not a machne) I went in and removed most of the tempo markers but left one every 4 or 8 bars. this way it stays pretty well in sync with the track, but may fluctuate in time (hundreths or thousands of a bpm) slightly between each maker. this works well for songs recorded without a click too - although you may need more tempo sync points depending on how bad the tempo fluctuates.

anyway, it got me a grid I could use. I could have used one of the existing drum machine tracks but I find that a straight click is so much eaisier for "identify beat" to sync on that it saved me time in the long run.

[dtrider]

you have to tap tempo and find something close to the part of the song you think is right on, then use the tempo editor or identify beat to change the tempo around... why bother. just edit the song so it feels right to you.

yes, totally subjective. I guess I was just looking for an easier route. I'll just keep doing what i'm doing. Thx

[Aquaman]

re: fixing a couple of bars where the band slowed down, and they're playing without a click

Easy! First, find a downbeat before the "bad section", and another downbeat after the bad section. Put markers at those spots (in sample mode). Turn on elastic time for that track, or those grouped tracks, or whatever.

Now, change the view to "Warp" mode, and select the smart tool. Find your markers. There should be faint lines on the beats. These are the analyzed spots for warping. You need to double click on the faint line nearest your "start" marker, which will put a little triangle on it. That warp point is now "anchored".

Do the same thing at the end: anchor the warp point on your chosen downbeat.

Now, just drag the ending warp anchor point back to the left. The audio BEFORE the starting anchor will stay the same. The audio AFTER the ending marker will not stretch, but will follow your drag back and forth. The audio BETWEEN the two anchor points will shrink as you lessen the distance between the two anchor points.

You can set up a tempo map if you want, but you don't really need to. Just shrink the "bad" audio until the tempo sounds OK with the rest of the tune. You might need to put additional anchor points in there if you need to make fine adjustments to a single bar or beat or something.

Go Go Elastic Audio!

[@?,*???&?]

I have had to do everything from tap the "in" arrow and paste along with the tempo, up through tab to transients, then beat detective. I have been "doing it by hand" since PT4.3, and beat detective can be a really creative tool, beyond the obvious drum quantizing crap. Using it like a slightly dummer recycle for all kinds of sonic mayhem can be amazing.

Yup.

Btw, in VST-land there is a plugin called 'Shaker Maker' that can set-up grooves from ANY sound.