Good mic for M/S technique

Professor T · Post by **Professor T** » Thu May 04, 2006 5:14 pm

Hi-

First post here--

I read about the M/S recording technique, and I'd really like to try it. Problem is, I don't have a figure 8 mic. What is a decent mic that can do this for around $350 or so? I'm using an mbox if that makes any difference.

Thanks!

jspartz · Post by **jspartz** » Thu May 04, 2006 5:23 pm

I use a pair of AT 4050's for this.

Jason

klangtone · Post by **klangtone** » Thu May 04, 2006 5:46 pm

I'm not sure if anyone is really selling them right now, but I've had success with the Oktava ML52 as the side in M/S. It should be in that price range.

Roy

philbo · Post by **philbo** » Thu May 04, 2006 7:22 pm

Welcome to TapeOp!

I've had great results using a Studio Projects B2 for the Fig. 8 mic, and an Audix for the cardoid. The B2 was about $200, but it may be less now.

Note that most of the less expensive multipattern mics (such as the B2) are condenser type, and you'll need phantom power to use them.

I have heard of the low-budget version of M/S, using 3 cardoid mics, if you want to experiment (I've never tried this myself, though):
1) Mid (just like normal M/S), pointing at the center of the stage
2) Pointing directly stage-left (at 90 degrees to mic 1)
3) Pointing directly stage-right (also at 90 degrees to mic 1)
The Side signal is made by inverting the signal from mic 3, and mixing it with mic 2.
It would probably be highly desirable to keep all the mic capsules as close to each other as possible...
________
ONE TREE HILL ADVICE

Professor T · Post by **Professor T** » Sat May 06, 2006 1:35 pm

thanks for the feedback--

on the ML52-- will it be damaged by phantom power? I'm using an mbox, so phantom power is on for my M mic- an audio technica AT3035.

Also, the 3 mic setup sounds cool, but I've only got 2 inputs on the mbox.

Thanks again for the great advice!

philbo · Post by **philbo** » Sat May 06, 2006 4:25 pm

Professor T wrote:thanks for the feedback--

on the ML52-- will it be damaged by phantom power? I'm using an mbox, so phantom power is on for my M mic- an audio technica AT3035.

Also, the 3 mic setup sounds cool, but I've only got 2 inputs on the mbox.

Thanks again for the great advice!

I'm not sure whether the ML will be damaged by phantom power or not. If it properly conforms to XLR standards, it will not. Generally I'd say you'd be safe. If you are nervous about it, consider adding an XLR ground-lift adapter between the ML & your M-audio interface, which will open the phantom power circuit.
________
VAPORIZER REVIEW

gregnrom · Post by **gregnrom** » Sat May 06, 2006 8:38 pm

Professor T wrote:Hi-

First post here--

I read about the M/S recording technique, and I'd really like to try it. Problem is, I don't have a figure 8 mic. What is a decent mic that can do this for around $350 or so? I'm using an mbox if that makes any difference.

Thanks!

Best for room sound-
radio shack PZM ($70) with the highest fidelity bidirectional mic you can find.

If you up your $$ a bit to get a nicer multipattern LDC (AT4050, ksm44 and the like) and have a decent cardioid or omni option you will be thankful. Those Stapes mics would be good ($?). In a pinch, a decent dynamic mic will work for the Mid as well.

Professor · Post by **Professor** » Sun May 07, 2006 12:26 am

I don't know quite why M/S is so desperately intrguing to so many folks - makes me think of soundguy dave's comments in that other recent M/S thread.
Do a quick search and you find a bunch of different threads about the setup and decoding and such alread out there.
As for mics, I always try to encourage identical mics for the Mid & Side mics. Yes, you could use dramatically different mics, but the decode will be quite unpredictable - it may 'sound cool' but it will also decode into a more confused image.
With that in mind, the best value for the money I could think of would actually be the Studio Projects LSD-2 dual stereo mic. It lists for $999 but discounts pretty low like the $600 range, and they even had a few demo models up on their website recently for $500. I know that's more than the $350 you asked about, but honestly I don't know about multi-pattern mics in that range. Maybe something from MXL, Apex, or some other low-cost builder.

-Jeremy

JWL · Post by **JWL** » Sun May 07, 2006 7:41 am

The Rode NT2A is about in your price range, maybe a bit over.

mjau · Post by **mjau** » Sun May 07, 2006 6:03 pm

Professor wrote:I don't know quite why M/S is so desperately intrguing to so many folks

Honestly, I think it's the cool science behind. At least, it is for me and my easy-to-impress-with-a-little-tech-science brain.
And the flexibility it lends, too. That's a big plus.

Professor · Post by **Professor** » Mon May 08, 2006 10:26 am

Oh I'm certainly a fan of the science and the setup itself, and I think it's important to learn it, know the sound/benefits/limits, and be able to whip it out when needed. I just also think it's weird to worry about the second mic a guy might be purchasing being able to create an MS pair.
Then again, I knew I was going to be doing location recording of primarily classical & acoustic ensembles when I started buying recording gear, so my first mic was an AT-4050, and my second mic was another AT-4050. It wasn't just for MS, but it was something I planned so I could hit all of the standard 2-mic stereo setups right off the bat.
Most guys that play the home game choose a fixed cardioid for their first condenser, and I would usually suggest that their second mic be another of the same model to make a stereo pair. But that's just my opinion - some folks would say, 'well you have a mic, now it's time for a bunch of different preamps'. Different philosophies, I suppose.

-Jeremy

jspartz · Post by **jspartz** » Mon May 08, 2006 10:49 am

I did the same thing. I picked up a pair of 4050's. I have enjoyed them as stereo X-Y, ORTF, M-S and Blumlien (crossed figure eights). They can cover a lot of ground for many types of recording productions.

Jason

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Mon May 08, 2006 12:00 pm

I just picked up an ((apex)) 460 after reading this bench test that was posted here the other day.

http://www.studioreviews.com/m16-460.htm

229 bucks......sounds great...outstanding value!!!

Harry

philbo · Post by **philbo** » Mon May 08, 2006 6:09 pm

Harry wrote:I just picked up an audix 460 after reading this bench test that was posted here the other day.

http://www.studioreviews.com/m16-460.htm

229 bucks......sounds great...outstanding value!!!

Harry

Your link points to a comparison of the RFT Telefunken & and an Apex. No Audix info.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue May 09, 2006 5:06 am

philbo wrote:
Harry wrote:I just picked up an audix 460 after reading this bench test that was posted here the other day.

http://www.studioreviews.com/m16-460.htm

229 bucks......sounds great...outstanding value!!!

Harry
Your link points to a comparison of the RFT Telefunken & and an Apex. No Audix info.

Sorry....Apex....Cheap brand...but a good mic(I will edit my post)

Message Board

Good mic for M/S technique

Good mic for M/S technique

Who is online