M/S techniques
- shakestheclown
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M/S techniques
Can this be done with 3 cardioid mics?
Maybe phase reverse one of the "side" mics?
Maybe phase reverse one of the "side" mics?
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I'm sure it can. Never tried it though. I wonder if it'd be as effective due to the cardioids having a wider pickup area compared to a figure-8. I would think that you'd have some phase issues since the diaphrams will have some distance between them with the side mics.
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From what I've read, and what I've been told, no, it won't. Or, at least it won't be M-S. It'd be something different. Not to mention more difficult than using a perfectly fine X-Y pattern.
The side-rejection of the figure-8 pattern is what allows this to work, I think. Rejection on cardoid patterns is not as strong, so you'll be having 2 'side' channels with a lot of 'mid' information in them.
If you don't have any figure-8 mics, just use X-Y, or ORTF until you can get one. There really isn't that big of a difference. I had to wait, too. I was so excited when I found out how M-S worked that I wanted to make it work without the right equipment, too. Now I'm doing the same thing with Blumlein (which I think sounds better for most of the applications on which I used M-S, and is easier) - and I have to wait for 2 matched figure 8 mics.
It sure is fun when you're able to use it, though.
Here's some good information about it. Scroll down at your leisure.
The side-rejection of the figure-8 pattern is what allows this to work, I think. Rejection on cardoid patterns is not as strong, so you'll be having 2 'side' channels with a lot of 'mid' information in them.
If you don't have any figure-8 mics, just use X-Y, or ORTF until you can get one. There really isn't that big of a difference. I had to wait, too. I was so excited when I found out how M-S worked that I wanted to make it work without the right equipment, too. Now I'm doing the same thing with Blumlein (which I think sounds better for most of the applications on which I used M-S, and is easier) - and I have to wait for 2 matched figure 8 mics.
It sure is fun when you're able to use it, though.
Here's some good information about it. Scroll down at your leisure.
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You can create a very close approximation to a figure-8 by putting two cardioids back-to-back and then changing the polarity (aka "flipping the phase") on one of them. Works plenty well enough for fooling around with M/S techniques. Just try to position the two mics such that their diaphragms are in the same plane.
- heylow
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Re: M/S techniques
Yo....if you search the forums a bit, I believe "professor (jeremy)" did a very well informed presentation of exactly this concept. Shouldn't be too tough to find....someone less lazy than I might even be inclined to find the link for you.shakestheclown wrote:Can this be done with 3 cardioid mics?
Maybe phase reverse one of the "side" mics?
heylow
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I seem to recall posting something about that - and I don't care to retype it or find it, but it's out there.
The short answer is, Yes, you can create an M/S setup with three cardioids.
Indeed, that's how it is done in most M/S stereo mics. And a multi-pattern mic is made by placing two cardioids back-to-back - they are cardioid when one is turned off, omni when the two are summed, and fig-8 when one is inverted & they are summed.
-Jeremy
The short answer is, Yes, you can create an M/S setup with three cardioids.
Indeed, that's how it is done in most M/S stereo mics. And a multi-pattern mic is made by placing two cardioids back-to-back - they are cardioid when one is turned off, omni when the two are summed, and fig-8 when one is inverted & they are summed.
-Jeremy
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http://messageboard.tapeop.com/viewtopic.php?t=34147Professor wrote:I seem to recall posting something about that - and I don't care to retype it or find it, but it's out there.
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