if ever you need to buy something at guitar center . . .

[willjohnston]

Of course some cables are built to last, and some are not. I just don't wanna hear any of this "extended frequency response" horseshit regarding monster cable. I thought that's the direction that "shitty hosa" comment was going.

Yes, making them yourself is the only way to go, since the guys we're all supposed to feel sorry for that work at GC are trained (and agree) to sell overpriced scam cables to unsuspecting folks.

Mogami cables are hardly a scam. For someone that doesn't know how/want to make their cables, they are a great way to go, they are just expensive. The deal is, they are clean sounding, "colorless"(as opposed to monster, which labels their cables coloration to attempt to market to specific genres and instruments), and reliable with a lifetime warranty.

cheap cables have a higher percentage markup than expensive cables, so your line of logic is completely off base. If i wanted to scam customers, I'd sell them 3 pro20m xlr cables(knowing they'd have to come back and buy more because they sound like shit and break) for the price of 1 25 foot mogami xlr. I'd make more money, and they'd be getting such a good deal!!!!

[2121TrumbullAve]

mogami , monster, etc. are way overpriced for what they are, end of story.

Don't tell me about hearing differences in cables, it's a sham.

If a cheapskate wants one cable, he's gonna buy one cheap cable, not 3, because 3 cheaps = 1 mogami...

therefore, you'd make better comission on the mogami sale.

Unless your comission is based on actual profits, and not total sales.

Please, tell me how a cable "sounds like shit". from my experience, they pass signal or do not.

[Rolsen]

I've got a love/hate relationship with the GC in my town (Tacoma, WA). Before GC, we had American Music, Ted Brown, a couple smaller outfits with good gear, and a smattering of 'Peavey and School Band' instrument shops. I swear to god that decent, good sounding guitars cost less now than they did 10 years ago. Back then, I had to deal with scumbag failed musicians in their 40's trying to rip me off. I guess I would prefer to haggle with a 19 year old.

My secondary 'hobby,' backpacking, is the same damn way as far as equipment is concerned! You'll find similar strings on backpacking forums. I'm sure its the same with RC cars, sport-import car parts, fine art supplies, tv's, etc. Dammit its hopeless!

BTW, cables DO make an audible difference. Its a cumulative effect. Replace your guitar, speaker, mic, patch, rca, monitor cables - everything your signal passes through. You will likely hear a difference.

[i am monster face]

When I worked in pro audio, I was given a GC quote that blew my mind by a good customer of mine. $439 for a Firepod? (Standard price was $599 at the time, now it is $499)How in the hell was that possible? But there it was, on paper. Of course...GC gets HUGE deals from manufacturers' with their huge buying power(not a bad thing, capitalism at work, but kind of unfair). So the end column that I could get at my store for buying fifteen pieces paled in comparison to their end column minus 20% for buying fifteen hundred pieces that they were getting.

The cost for my store was $525, and we were selling them for $599.

So no, I don't feel sorry for the employees when people go into GC and haggle because GC comes into town with 100% markup and I'm making 15% on end column pricing (less than that on non-end column) and selling higher end focusrite and universal audio stuff almost at a loss. I shed no tear for the employee who lies to get his customer to buy KRK Rokit monitors and Behringer control surfaces because they have the higher markup and get better deals. Not because they sound better, but because they get better markup. Marginalizing the industry boys and girls.

But really, I like the GC in Minneapolis as well.

Ian

[tuggjohnson]

I used to work there as of a few weeks ago, so here's my advice.
1. True and not True. If you are a cool dude working on music i find interesting, I'd give you a discount without you even asking. If you're some one that walks in dressed to the nines and is a prick to me, I'll let you walk out even though management says walk no one.

2. The only customers I told base cost to were people that I had extremely close relationships with and was practically selling them the gear at cost regardless.

3. If you grind the salesperson down on prices, and they conceed, and you ask for free stuff on top of that, get fucked. I'll explain why in a second.

4. Absolutely not true, especially in pro audio. Selling price("guaranteed lowest price") has little to do with cost. Certain items sell for 399 yet dealer cost(which is inflated) is only 199, yet other items will sell for 1599 and cost is 1347.


Heres the thing about guitar center. If you have a guy at the store you always buy from and refuse to buy from anyone else, and you buy significant amounts of gear (a sm57 every three months and some shitty hosa or pro20m cables don't qualify for a "pro account"), then you should expect a discount.

All guitar center sales staff are paid on commission. It varies from store to store, but for example, I made 6.15 an hour, and 10% of gross profit(difference between price gear is sold for and dealer cost/advertisting/shipping) and 2% of the total gross sale. Not only is that the case, but your commission fades against your hourly, meaning that if you do not earn more in comission than you get paid hourly, you do not receive commission. Employees of guitar center essentially pay to work there.

That being said, when you haggle an employee down on pricing, you aren't "taking advantage of a corporate whore" like guitar center, you are taking money out of the employees pocket, and let me tell you, unless you are a top writer in the store, you don't make shit. I am working at a coffee shop again, and as far as hourly earnings break down, I am doing better per hour than I was at guitar center when i was in the top 10 for sales of the store.

Getting a deal rules, and when you buy a lot of gear, it helps, but remember that not many places honestly sell the gear for less than guitar center does, and if you find it at another store for cheaper, they do match prices and guarentee it for 30 days.

I'm not saying don't ask for deals, as long as someone was cool and genuinely interested in the music they were working on, I had no problem losing some of my paycheck to help them out. I had a lot of customers that I was their "go to" guy, and the most important part of that store is having a guy.

Along the same lines, I have/had contacts with a lot of vendors and distributors and dealer reps, so when my loyal customers had a problem with something, I was more than willing to go to bat for them.


That was long winded, but that's the end of my rant.

This is a good case in point. You're clearly the exception to the rule, at least, in Los Angeles. The fact is, the average GC employee acts as though they've just seen Glengary Glenross a dozen times and are willing to scam a corpse if they can. The point of my posting was to give people a 'heads up'. I've wasted enough money and have little sympathy for salesmanship. I work for a shitty corporation as well and feel as though it's my moral and civic duty to give people a fair shake unless they're a complete and utter asshole, but then I'm only being vindicative.

[willjohnston]

All in all, i'm not out to say gc is great and the best place in the world, and i think they have a deserved reputation in the industry for not knowing shit. At my store however, despite a few shitty salespeople, most of the people there weren't out to gouge the customer and didn't sell stuff based on profit but based on need.

I wasn't anywhere near the salesman management thought i should be because I had all the knowledge there could be at the place(figurateively speaking) but i didn't give a fuck about selling stuff or adding on items i really didn't think the customer needed, or selling a performance guarantee that isn't likely to break.

(side note on performance guarantees: Any drummers out there or people buying cymbals for studios should probably actually get them from GC and get the performance gurantee on it. If the cymbal is less than 200 bucks, you get a 2 year full replacement warranty that covers any cracking. Pretty sweet deal, actually.)



As far as that cable argument goes, you seriously can't understand how oxygen free copper wiring will have better conductivity than oxyginated copper? Mogami cables are manufactured in Japan, rather than china or korea, which means on average, the caliber of production is higher.

As someone said, everything in your signal chain makes an impact on sound quality. Then again, you might be the type of person that says a pickup is a pickup, a mic is a mic, a preamp is a preamp.

[2121TrumbullAve]

Yeah, I might be that type of person...but probably not.

When I was your age, people thought anything made in Japan sucked...

Oxygenated what? Nope, don't understand, don't care. All marketing.

This back and forth is getting old. peace to you, mogami fan. I'm glad you got out of GC.

I'd like to hear your opinion of my previous thread "is it really new":

http://messageboard.tapeop.com/viewtopic.php?t=37909

[Johnny B]

When I was your age, people thought anything made in Japan sucked...

I'm assuming this was before Honda and Toyota started beating up on Ford, GM and Chrysler in the 1980's. Things change. I heart my Japanese guitar.

[???????]

TOKAI GUITARS. WHOOT.

GC sucks.

Good cables matter but not as much as good performances and good playing.

Oxygen-free copper is not marketing. Ignorance is not bliss.

THE END.