crappy kick sound... beta 52's fault?

[Kevin Kitchel]

naaa, i'm here for the free pens and mom jokes.

Where do I get free pens?

(please don't say your mom!)

[bniesz]

In my experience, the Beta 52 likes to be just inside the vent hole in the reso head. Like have the grill inside the drum with the rest of the mic outside the drum.

I dunno how much SPL the Beta 52 can handle, but that's a really great way to blow up the capsule. The vent hole, by far, is the location that pushes the most SPL - and I've blown up a D112 or two by putting it to much in the center of the hole.

I almost never put the kick mic inside the drum. Sounds like a basketball. There's usually 5 other mics on the kit that are gonna hear some of the snap (especially the snare mic, and the OH). I want some low end, and it's easier to find outside the drum.

[farview]

I dunno how much SPL the Beta 52 can handle, but that's a really great way to blow up the capsule. The vent hole, by far, is the location that pushes the most SPL - and I've blown up a D112 or two by putting it to much in the center of the hole.

I almost never put the kick mic inside the drum. Sounds like a basketball. There's usually 5 other mics on the kit that are gonna hear some of the snap (especially the snare mic, and the OH). I want some low end, and it's easier to find outside the drum.

You didn't blow up the D112 by putting it in the vent hole, something else happened. My D112 is damn near 20 years old and was originally used for live shows where it was frequently placed in the vent hole.

The Beta 52 was designed to be placed at the vent hole. A puff of air isn't going to take out a healthy kick drum mic.

[trodden]

naaa, i'm here for the free pens and mom jokes.

Wanna swap those pens for this mackie onyx?

ahahah naaaa, i'll use the pens.

[blakbeltjonez]

the Beta 52 is verrrry common these days in live sound reinforcement - it seems to be universally placed an inch or two just inside the port of the front head aimed towards the beater, which should give you the requisite balance of low end sub/lo mid cut/beater attack. if it's placed corrrectly you shouldn't need much EQ at all if any (the b-52 does the all-important 250-400 Hz lo-mid whack that would ordinarily be done on the input strip).

i would imagine it might sound kinda clicky and gutless all the way inside the kick, unless Drummer Dude maybe used a felt kick beater (nearly all rock/pop/R&B drummers i deal with use a plastic beater). the port of the kick drum is where the air moves, and that's an essential component of a good (rock/pop/R&B/etc) modern kick sound. having a decent kick head like a clear or coated Powerstroke III, Evans EQ3 or even a good ol' Ambassador coated or pinstripe is a must. if you have some bunk ass head with a dent 1/8" deep where the beater hits, run, do not walk to your nearest music store.

if you're having trouble with the 52 how it's normally placed, change your kick drum tuning. if it's tuned up too high, there won't be much air moving at the port at the frequencies you want. make sure the beater head isn't too tight, once that's been established loosen the front head incrementally until it's in the ballpark. whatever you're using as a dampener inside can make a difference too. sometimes a pillow just doesn't cut it - it's good to have one of those velcro attached mini-pillow thingys around just to see if it improves the sound of the drum. move the pillow in the drum to see what works (usually pillow set more against front head works best - keeps overtones damped, if you don't want a roomy sounding kick) some empirical observation, patience and experimentation will get you where you need to be, EQ'ing the daylights out of a badly placed mic is a sign that something's very wrong.

this is all assuming that the drummer's foot is OK. if he can't kick it hard enough, you will be doing some degree of damage control no matter what.

[joel hamilton]

It is hard to answer these kind of questions. The answer to "how do i get a better [X] sound?" is usually "record more."

The more you do it, the better you will get at it, the better your sounds will be.

That, I can promise you.

All the other stuff is SO heavily dependent on so many variables that are not easily described in words, that i can not see giving a misleading answer that will set you off on a NEW, but equally "wrong" path towards a good kick drum sound.

Have fun. That would be my answer. Have fun, and dont ever blame your tools. They work for YOU.

[Kevin Kitchel]

Free pens sound pretty good!

[highballrecording]

I'm and drummer and have suffered from severe neurosis many times when trying to achieve "that" kick drum sound. Over the years, I've owned the Shure Beta 52, AKG D-112, and now the Electrovoice ND-868. I'm relatively happy with the 868 and began using it once I started to really understand exactly what sound I desired based on familiar recordings. The Beta 52 is a fine mic though.

Probably the most important thing to come to grips with when it comes to mic'ing the kick drum is that all of the above listed mics have tailored frequency responses. You can EQ all day long... but that shouldn't be necessary if you have a decent idea of how the mic wants to sound. You shouldn't have to EQ the Beta 52 much at all... seriously. It's already been done for you.

People's perceptions of a "good" kick drum sound tend to really differ. The main thing that I listen for is a full, balanced sound that sits low in the mix without ANY conflicting high frequency distortion on the attack. In other words, the attack IMO should sound more like tapping a single pen on a table, as opposed to 2 or 3 pens at the same time. The best engineers can regularly achieve this clean sound... unless the style of music calls for otherwise (loud metal, punk, etc.). Listening for this also helps me find the sweet spot.

Now that I've said far more than necessary, go out and invest in a good kick drum beater side head. I like the Aquarian Super Kick II. These heads sound great if tuned somewhat loose (but not too loose)... probably about 1 full turn past the point that the lugs catch. If the head is too loose, it'll sound sloppy... too tight, like a cardboard box. Don't dampen it much (if any). Remove the front head and experiment with mic placements just outside drum. I've had good success by putting the mic down low and toward the edge of the drum with the capsule pointed at the beater. Don't be afraid to experiment and spend a couple of hours exhausting all possibilities. You'll spend a lot longer trying to surgically EQ an unacceptable sounding track... trust me, it won't work. Did I mention that you shouldn't have to do much EQ'ing?

I hope some of this helps. Don't drive yourself too crazy once you find a good mic placement. Even if it doesn't sound so great solo'ed, it may sit in the mix just fine.

[JamesHE]

I like the Beta 52 on kick when the drummer dosen't have a lot of ass behind his foot. Perfect for that rare drummer that plays a little soft.

And if you ever have a maniac with a Big 22" Gong Bass Drum, it's just the ticket. (miced from underneath about 6" outside the shell a little off center) - and of course that guy slaps the crap out of the kick so you want to use somthing else.

Does the clamping mechanism on anyones B52 work right? what's up with that spring? I swear mine got screwd up the first time I used it. Oh wait I wasen't the first owner so maybe it was broken before. I have to crank down harder and harder every time for it to stay put.