"Big" (in the context of New Age) piano sound

[YOUR KONG]

Hey all

I'm working a new age track right now with the piano as the lead instrument...have never done this before, so wondering if you all had any experience getting a nice big - yet smooth and inoffensive! - piano sound.

I added some very gentle compression (1:1.5) with a loooong attack time and looong release time - to add a little "pop" but more of a "curve" (as I imagine it).

My gut tells me to add some subtle delay, but I haven't gotten to that point yet.

Waddya say?

[effector]

double the part in octaves.

[JGriffin]

I always think reverb--really obvious reverb-- when I think of New Age piano.

[dirk_v]

and scoop the mids.

-dv

[Professor]

Depends on the tone of the piano itself and the other instruments in accompanying it from track to track. I think of 'new age piano' as being full, warm, clear at the top but not at all 'bright', and close to me but in a very large space.

My piano tends to run a little bright, and is incredibly huge for the space we're in anyway. When I do things on the new-agey side, I usually try to soften up the attacks a little bit. Obviously when the piano is the focal point of the mix you can't soften too much or it won't cut through the rest of the group, but it has still helped me to aim in that direction.
I start at the mic (as usual) and will usually pick something that is naturally kind of darker. I've used ribbons and tube mics on some projects, but on the most recent I used an AKG C-422 as my primary mic. I am pretty sure it is transformerless, but can't remember for certain, either way the tone is a lot like a C-414 TLII, or a Neuman TLM-193 or U-89... well maybe not as rich as a U-89. This was a solo piano recording, so I still needed a clear top and the fast response of a condenser, although I softened the edges a bit by running the mic through my pair of ViPres with like a Med-Slow rise time. Then I had a pair of small, transformerless omnis as outriggers arranged in a sort of modified Decca Tree with the C-422.
Yeah, I know that's really specific, and you probably don't have that particular gear, definitely not this beast of a piano, and the style might be quite different. But that's what worked for me.
I do compress because it brings up the soft stuff and moves the instrument a little closer for intamacy. I set the threshold really low and the ratio too, like -36db, 1.5:1, so the thing is pretty much always on. But where I differ from your approach is that I pull that attack back to the fastest I can possibly make it so I can control the attack envelope on each individual piano note. I do use a longer release, but not too long because I want it to recover for the next note if necessary... maybe .5 seconds or so. If you're using a really long attack, then you're just letting the original attack fly and bringing up the decay which might get too unnatural if you're not careful. I look at shaping the attack through the mic, preamp and compressor attack time as kind of like needling the hammers to soften up each strike, but then I can switch mics for the next session and have something bright and upfront again.
Reverb is, of course, really important to the style, but I find that I tend to use reverbs with no delays because those can really mess with the rhythm of the music, especially if there is a lot of movement on the top end. I go for spacious room sounds with no delay, very little early reflections, but a nice warm reverb with a long but reasonable tail, like maybe 2.5 to 3.5 seconds depending on the tempo of the track. Of course, it helps that I've got TC reverbs that sound ridiculously realistic, but if you've got a good large hall or cathedral sound and tweak it right, you can get there with most boxes.

Yeah, I know that's pretty much the opposite of all the other ideas mentioned so far, but like I said, it depends a lot on where you're starting and what's going on in the track.

-Jeremy

[godwinaudio]

Okay, here's what I do.

Two Royer Ribbons on the sides, U-87 in the center. Royers through Avalon mic pre's/comps. U-87 goes through the console... a Trident. I understand if you don't have all that stuff, but, it's a good thought for similair style mics. 2 ribbons, something center. Then, I often times double things at different octaves. That's a great suggestion which I know somebody already posted. It's pretty huge and clean.


Christopher Godwin
Godwin Audio

[joelkriske]

do you mean Harold Budd style new age, or george winston style new age?

Harold Budd was all Eno style, with juicy reverb, long tails, etc. George Winston was more in your face (if you could ever call new age music in your face.) There are different flavors, could you reference a specific song or artist? New age, as a genera, is a bit too vague for nerds like me...

would love to hear the finished song!