Your Space / Neighbor Relations / Where you at?

stevebozz · Post by **stevebozz** » Mon May 21, 2007 9:48 am

As a recording-type with gear and two bands, it's been nice to have multiple people chip in for spaces in Philadelphia. We've been in all sorts of different warehouses that worked on a temporary basis, and we're now at a nice spot.

When we first looked at the place, the landlord was all "yeah, play until 1 in the morning, no sweat!" and then we slowly find out people are living upstairs in the warehouse and we're getting complaints and stuff at night, the super making up rules like "curfew is at 10." I feel for the people upstairs but come on, we pay $400 a month for this spot to play music after work and on the weekends.

So, I'm frustrated, and I'm curious how tape-oppers found the spaces they have found, if they have any strange neighbors or weird things going on, how you work it out, other difficulties and ideas for how to find an ideal spot.

Please share your stories!

christopher dwyer · Post by **christopher dwyer** » Mon May 21, 2007 11:42 am

i rent a house out outside of allentown, pa (macungie to be exact) i got lucky enough that i can do all my music needs in the basement i have 3 seperate rooms a drum live room where our band also practices then a control room with a utility room that has our washer and dryer in there and a bathroom.
i've had the same problem you had for a while before i got the house i found this factory i believe its a machine shop in quakertown, pa called vertech, we rented one of the office rooms out in there for 250 a month but had access to all the rooms after hours its was alright. anyway good luck.
-christopher
-----------------
www.myspace.com/thebitterlifetypecast
www.myspace.com/thegatsbyrecording

JASIII · Post by **JASIII** » Mon May 21, 2007 11:54 am

I got lucky. I rent a house on the edge of town in a nice neighborhood, a mix of really expensive homes and little shacks (on a body of water even!) I live in one of the little shacks, used to be someone's summer cottage in the 50's. On one side lives my landlord, who is a cool guy in his early 40's with money. He doesn't care about much, except taking it easy. On the other side is an older (60-70's?), single guy. I built a studio in my house. The landlord thinks it's cool that I'm doing it. The old guy's house on the other side has his garage nearest to my studio, so I doubt he hears anything. Last summer he tore down his old house and built a new one. He didn't even live there for almost a year during construction. With all the hell he put us through with the construction (ever live next door to a house being built? It SUCKS! LOUD! Earth shakes from equipment, lots of dumb, construction worker types around) I don't think he'll say peep while I'm doing business! In my backyard is a Great Lake, across the street is a wooded wildlife sanctuary. No one to bother except the squirrels and the ducks and pelicans!

MT · Post by MT » Mon May 21, 2007 12:24 pm

JASIII wrote:In my backyard is a Great Lake, across the street is a wooded wildlife sanctuary. No one to bother except the squirrels and the ducks and pelicans!

You have no idea how depressing that part is when read from a cubicle. Wow.

xonlocust · Post by **xonlocust** » Mon May 21, 2007 1:22 pm

my studio is in my house, and no loud sounds after 10pm as a courtesy to my neighbors, and more importantly my GF. i don't practice there.

my bands have always practiced at any number of practice space warehouses in the city where you can be loud at any hour of the day or night. seems like there should be a better practice space for you guys in town somewhere - since people live there, i think the 10pm thing is reasonable from thier point of view, but it's not reasonable from your point of view. the landlord should have it one or the other - practice space or living space. he's screwing both tenants in the current situaion.

klangtone · Post by **klangtone** » Mon May 21, 2007 1:31 pm

I got randomly hooked up into this awesome house with a huge living room. I've been there the longest now so I sort of "control" the situation. I chose to rent two rooms in the house so I could convert the room adjacent to the living room into a control room and still have my own bedroom. A friend rents the studio during the day when I'm at work. So that helps. Just had to find a roommate that was cool with the noise.

As far as neighbors go, it's worked out fine so far. We are on a corner which helps. Although we're also on a busy street which sucks. Car noise in anything quiet.

Here's my advice for neighbors... be respectful. It may not work for your schedule, but I am pretty strict about keeping the loud stuff to be over by 10pm. I've had 0 complaints in like 6 years, so it's working.

Also, never complain about their noise! heh. That should be obvious.

Roy

buzzaudioguy · Post by **buzzaudioguy** » Tue May 22, 2007 7:18 am

I'm renting out a space upstairs from a cool club/bar. It's actually across from the dressing room for the touring bands that come through so I get alot of pop in's. They don't care when and what I do up there because they're used to noisy bands. It also doesn't matter if I'm working up there while a show's going on downstairs. They don't ever seem to hear me, but unfortunately I do hear them. Mostly the subs. So if a show's going on downstairs I don't do things like acoustics or vocals upstairs. But I usually just don't work up there anytime they've got a show going on. Days are almost always quiet and totally workable. I also rent out part of my space to some friends to practice there. So it's cheap, secure and anytime I wanna run down to grab a beer or watch a band it's right there! So I like it.

Jon Nolan · Post by **Jon Nolan** » Tue May 22, 2007 7:47 am

buzzaudioguy wrote:I'm renting out a space upstairs from a cool club/bar. It's actually across from the dressing room for the touring bands that come through so I get alot of pop in's.

Buzz - you upstairs from juanita's? cool place! played there once. and i bought an echoplex at atomic guitars. my wife would groan everytime she saw little rock on the tour schedule, 'cuz she knew she'd be getting a call. "Hi honey! How are things? Ummmm, so we're in little rock, and there's this awesome piece of gear I found...." and vino's - goooood pizza!

as for neighbors, my space is in a neighborhood with a mix of college student/local yokel apartments. it isn't 'proofed' in the least, and I've been there for six or seven years - save one year in the middle there, where I foolishly got our of it and gave it to an acquainantace. That guy had loads of problems with the neighbors, but I haven't really. Years ago, a dude asked us to stop at 10pm on the weekdays, so I keep to that. weekends, all bets are off, and I rock until 1 or 2am. haven't had any issues really

My neighbors are great, and most have said they enjoy the music filling the neighborhood. I try to be nice, to chat them up when i see them, and to make sure they tell me when they need me to shut the hell up.

i keep all serious tracking to known "friendly times."

jon

Jeff White · Post by **Jeff White** » Tue May 22, 2007 7:57 am

stevebozz wrote:When we first looked at the place, the landlord was all "yeah, play until 1 in the morning, no sweat!" and then we slowly find out people are living upstairs in the warehouse and we're getting complaints and stuff at night, the super making up rules like "curfew is at 10." I feel for the people upstairs but come on, we pay $400 a month for this spot to play music after work and on the weekends.

People are living in the warehouse? Is that place zoned for that? Just curious. If you were lead to believe that you could make as much nose as you want until 1am, signed a lease (did you?) and now find out something different, that is grounds for you to legally get out of that lease (I would think) and move on. I know that NJ is all about covering the renters' asses in situations like this, so you should check out Philly rental laws.

Have the police shown up? Did you get the "1am thing" in writing? Did you sign a lease?

stevebozz wrote: So, I'm frustrated, and I'm curious how tape-oppers found the spaces they have found, if they have any strange neighbors or weird things going on, how you work it out, other difficulties and ideas for how to find an ideal spot.

Please share your stories!

I had an apartment in Palmyra for 3.5 yrs with a nice attic to record amps in, but everything else about that place kind of sucked (landlord was State Trooper and a dick, power was horrible, etc). I had two sets of neighbors over the 3.5 yrs in the bottom part of the house below me. I gave them my cell number and told them to call me if the noise was too much, always offered them beer when I saw them doing gardening, etc. And guess what? 2 complaints in 3.5 yrs, only one related to recording. Neightbors outside of the immediate house never complained.

I can use and have used my folks' barn for drums, and even though it is in a neighborhood, no worries, no complaints. We recorded between 10am and 6pm, though. No late nights.

I can also use the office that I work at (the owner is very cool) for drums, amps etc on Sat/Sunday nights (no one else in the building), but we're moving, so not sure about the new office space. I tend to take my powerbook all over the place and record in spaces that work for the instruments. Lots of friends' living rooms for stuff, too.

I was in a band a few yrs back that practiced in the gtr players house. We got gun-shy about levels after the cops showed up a few times and were no longer ammused. Of course the older couple who kept calling them were the couple that everyone in Conshohocken heard fighting all of the time. I think that the husband lived in their car most nights. Anyway, we looked into getting a space in Philly but some folks felt that practicing at low levels was the solution, then I left the band due to work and other projects.

I'm saving for a house right now and a major factor when buying is going to be recording. I want to be able to cut guitars and vox etc there, as well as mix at a decent level. Drums would be great, but honestly, not the deal breaker. Street noise / neighbors etc will be taken into consideration as well. I want to have a great space but I understand that recording drums in a row home in Philly or in the middle of a quiet town like Collingswood may not go over well. I'll have to use the Powerbook for that and keep a drum space handy.

Good luck, let us know how things go.

Jeff

buzzaudioguy · Post by **buzzaudioguy** » Tue May 22, 2007 8:22 am

Jon! Yeah! That's my place! That's too damn funny. I've been there just over two years now and I love it. Yep, Atomic Guitars is no more, but Johnny still wheels and deal around these parts. Vino's pizza is still good too. Let me know next time you come through! Anyway, I won't railroad the topic. Next please!

kayagum · Post by **kayagum** » Tue May 22, 2007 9:52 am

This issue is why I've been experimenting with direct input recording for 10+ years. I still have and use my original SansAmp pedal from the early 90s.

stevebozz · Post by **stevebozz** » Tue May 22, 2007 4:28 pm

We are month-to-month, and no unfortunately we didn't get it in writing.. the landlord was a fast mover, and past our better judgment, we just sort of moved in and called the place a space.

We've been completely cooperative and friendly with our neighbors. The cops never come, it's in Port Richmond, which is a very industrial area. Personally, I don't think it's legal for people to live in that building, and I agree the landlord is being unfair to everyone.

One of the problems is the landlord doesn't live there and doesn't seem to care, he placates us when we have problems and then the live-in "super" is the one who complains and tells us to stop playing. He's generally a jerk, yells at people for parking in "his spot" even though it's not marked, he just seems to be power-tripping.

I think we'll be OK, rarely will we be tracking drums late at night, but when you're rehearsing for a big gig coming up and some dude tells you to 'calm down' without any sort of communication, compromising or a shred of politeness, it rubs you the wrong way. When he's rude to my clients, it's even worse. On the other hand, since he seems to hold some clout, we want to stay on this guy's good side. What a struggle!

I had great luck in a south philly rowhome for a year, tracked in the basement, control room in a spare bedroom. Great advice from some folks about being totally friendly and communicative with neighbors-- don't give them any reasons to be upset with you besides the noise, and they'll probably overlook it. Rehearsing within reasonable hours is also a good move.

I guess overall what I'm curious about is how people find the spaces they find, and how do you check out whether playing loud would work or not. I'm interested in buying some property, if I'm looking for that ideal house, what are the questions to ask besides "how are the neighbors?" Perhaps it's mostly common sense, luck and friendliness that gets you by.

I really enjoyed hearing where people are and what they have to deal with, makes me feel blessed to even have a space to be loud in, even if we have to shutup after 10.

river · Post by **river** » Fri May 25, 2007 12:47 pm

My wife & I bought our property almost 6 years ago specifically for studio space. There's a guesthouse with wood floors and cathedral ceiling in the living room area which is the tracking space. I converted the kitchen into the control room. It's in the middle of a generous amount of acreage, vegetable fields on three adjacent sides and a large ridge behind. The only hassle is when the farmer is tilling with his tractor, hard to track grand piano. Even so, it hasn't been a real inconvenience , and no neighbors close enough to hear anything from me.

mjau · Post by **mjau** » Sat May 26, 2007 8:20 am

I am exceedingly lucky in that I'm a caretaker for a historic house in town, so my wife and I get to live in a beautiful old house in a really posh neighborhood and don't have to pay any rent. One neighbor moved away but didn't want to sell her house (so it's completely vacant), and the other is a nonagenarian who is hard of hearing. I get to record in a big house and never have to worry about making noise at any hour.

Recycled_Brains · Post by **Recycled_Brains** » Wed May 30, 2007 7:00 am

man... some of you guys sound like you have really great spaces. i'm pretty excited about my new set-up. my girlfriend and I just moved into a new apartment here in Albany that has a HUGE living room with really high ceilings, that with a little bit of wall treatment, will sound really nice (already does, just a bit more live than i'd like). and there's 2 other rooms that can be used... one is my control room (which has enough space for tracking), and a third smaller room that i'll probably deaden up for amps and vocals.

it's one of those brick buildings that ajoins the buildings on either side (like a brownstone), so sound leakage from side-to-side is pretty much no issue at all since there's probably 3 feet or more of brick dividing the buildings. the guys upstairs are great. totally cool about noise (younger dudes that are really into music). i record mostly acoustic music w/ the occassional loud guitar, and some quiet drums here and there. i wouldn't record my metal band or really lound punk/rock type stuff, but i've got other places to do that. my biggest issues in the past were street noise, not enough space, and roommates who played guitar hero 6 hours a day (serenity now!).

-ryan

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