Mastering Question: Moving PQ codes to work in the negatives

Recording Techniques, People Skills, Gear, Recording Spaces, Computers, and DIY

Moderators: drumsound, tomb

Post Reply
Gabe
audio school graduate
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2005 9:14 am
Location: Manhattan, NY

Mastering Question: Moving PQ codes to work in the negatives

Post by Gabe » Sun Jun 03, 2007 8:51 pm

Hey everyone,

You know how on certain cd's (that you buy) some audio info plays in between tracks, for instance it isn't a part of track 2 or of track 3 but rather in that negative space before track 3 starts. i heard that moving around the PQ codes is the way to achieve this because you have audio on the cd that is not identified as its own track on the CD.

I always thought this effect was very entertaining when listening to an album. Also i love when there is actually a hidden track before the first song starts that can only be heard if you rewind the cd before the first assigned track by the PQ code.

What type of programs allow you to move the PQ codes around? Can i make hidden tracks on the albums i'm recording from home?

Thanks guys and girls.

User avatar
Roboburger
buyin' gear
Posts: 536
Joined: Wed May 07, 2003 7:44 am
Location: Williamstown, MA

Post by Roboburger » Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:10 pm

Wrong Forum- This should be in the computer section. But to answer, I use CD Architect (PC only) to do my PQ code wackiness. It's nice to make CDs of live shows such that as you listen to them, them play like the show went down. But if you rip them to iTunes, all of the between-song silence and stage chatter doesn't get ripped, just the info that was defined as the song file by the codes.

Understand?
Audio Engineer Euphemism for going number two: "Rollin' off the Low End."

User avatar
T-rex
dead but not forgotten
Posts: 2142
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2004 5:44 am
Location: Louisville KY

Post by T-rex » Tue Jun 12, 2007 11:54 am

Hey Roboburger, does CD Arch let you write CD text etc.? I am looking at getting either that or Wavelab essentials.
[Asked whether his shades are prescription or just to look cool]
Guy: Well, I am the drummer.

User avatar
Mark Alan Miller
dead but not forgotten
Posts: 2097
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2004 6:58 pm
Location: Western MA
Contact:

Post by Mark Alan Miller » Tue Jun 12, 2007 10:28 pm

I use CD Architect, too (an older version, and I don't know if newer ones support CD+Text)... And Jam (with Toast) can do it, IIRC.

In my experience, when ripping a CD to iTunes, the negative-count bits (technically the index 0 of the following track) gets attached to the end of the prior track, not excluded. Unless there is a preference setting I'm not aware of.
he took a duck in the face at two and hundred fifty knots.

http://www.radio-valkyrie.com/ao/aoindex.htm - download the new record (free is an option!) or get it on CD.

Bob Weston
pluggin' in mics
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2007 10:34 pm
Location: Logan Square
Contact:

Post by Bob Weston » Wed Jun 13, 2007 8:09 am

That countdown area before a song is called the Index 0 section. Then the track starts at Index 1.

In the PQ codes there are Start of Track markers and End of Track markers. If the End marker for one track and the Start marker for the next are placed at the same point on the timeline, there is no count-down. If there is a space between the End marker, and the next Start marker, that's where the count-down happens...in between tracks.

bob weston

drumsound
zen recordist
Posts: 7474
Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2004 10:30 pm
Location: Bloomington IL
Contact:

Post by drumsound » Wed Jun 13, 2007 8:35 am

Good to see you here Bob!

User avatar
carlsaff
takin' a dinner break
Posts: 166
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 11:55 am
Location: Chicago
Contact:

Post by carlsaff » Wed Jun 13, 2007 11:19 am

If you use CUE sheet burning, then it's just a text file edit. Here's a cue sheet for a three-track disc:

Code: Select all

FILE "master.wav" WAVE
  TRACK 01 AUDIO
    INDEX 01 00:00:00
  TRACK 02 AUDIO
    INDEX 01 02:13:12
  TRACK 03 AUDIO
    INDEX 01 06:56:33
But if you wanted track 2 to be "hidden" (i.e. not reflected in the disc track count) and to countdown in reverse in the space before track 2:

Code: Select all

FILE "master.wav" WAVE
  TRACK 01 AUDIO
    INDEX 01 00:00:00
  TRACK 02 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 02:13:12
    INDEX 01 06:56:33
Hey Bob!
Carl Saff Mastering
http://www.saffmastering.com

Johnny B
pushin' record
Posts: 271
Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2006 5:18 pm
Location: Syracuse, NY
Contact:

Post by Johnny B » Wed Jun 13, 2007 9:34 pm

And if you want to be really tricky, put audio at index 0 of track 1. Then the only way you can hear it is to start the disc and then scan backwards through the first track. There are a couple of commercial discs out there like this. The ones I know about are Factory Showroom by They Might Be Giants and Losing Streak by Less Than Jake, although apparently there are a few more out there.

However, a lot of cd burners will reject a cue sheet with a track 1 0 index of longer than 2 seconds. And, I think some pressing plants won't do them.

Bob Weston
pluggin' in mics
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2007 10:34 pm
Location: Logan Square
Contact:

Post by Bob Weston » Thu Jun 14, 2007 8:03 am

Hi Carl, Hi Tony, Hi studio nerds.

nerdly yours,
bob

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 27 guests