Is the Ipod killing the 'Album'?

[Alex Netick]

I just retired my ipod, and I'm starting to enjoy listening to music again. True -- the iTunes website is becoming a pretty deep record store, where you can find almost anything, and there is some incredibly cool stuff for free (e.g., the Folkways Podcast). I think a dollar is too much for a song, especially when I'd be just as happy buying vinyl for 3 or 4 dollars at a used record store, or going and getting music free from my local library.

[akg414]

The other side of that is what happens when I'm listening to iTunes/iPod--I put it in shuffle mode and let it do its thing. I've heard much more of my music collection, and gotten more familiar with it, than I had in the few years prior where I tended to just pull out the 15 or so "favorite" CDs all the time.

Agreed.

[Tragabigzanda]

I think this all runs a lot deeper than music. As consumers, we're really inundated with products that are made fast, cheap, and without attention to quality. There's a great quote in the new Tape OP that "quality doesn't cost, it pays," and I really believe that to be true...

The albums vs. singles debate is sort of irrelevant; they both serve their purpose. It's our job to make recordings with attention to detail, to the quality of the musicians, the instruments used, the signal path, the recording medium, and finally, the distribution, marketing, and promotion.

I think it's like French food: smaller, richer portions, and you're taste buds explode, but your belly doesn't. Same thing with music. Certainly, Taco Bell has it's time and place, as does a band like, say, Fanny Pack...

But everyone should take great pride in their work, regardless of vocation. It'll show in the final product, and the consumer will respond in kind.

[???????]

that's something I've observed as well. It seems that up until several decades ago, the best minds were all put to work developing the absolute best technology that would give the absolute best result, regardless of cost.

Now it seems that (post-Nixon or so) the best minds are put to work to take existing technology and develop ways to make it cheaper, smaller, easier, or faster.

In audio, musical instruments, recording gear, etc asa well as many other areas, the current "high-end" stuff is all clones of things the great minds of decades ago came up with, while the new great minds are making cheaper and cheaper ways to get something that's "almost as good" or "virtually indistinguishable."

[tomberdude]

that's something I've observed as well. It seems that up until several decades ago, the best minds were all put to work developing the absolute best technology that would give the absolute best result, regardless of cost.

Now it seems that (post-Nixon or so) the best minds are put to work to take existing technology and develop ways to make it cheaper, smaller, easier, or faster.

In audio, musical instruments, recording gear, etc as well as many other areas, the current "high-end" stuff is all clones of things the great minds of decades ago came up with, while the new great minds are making cheaper and cheaper ways to get something that's "almost as good" or "virtually indistinguishable."

Holy shit! I thought i was the only person who acknowledged this!

I've never quite understood why the iPod took off, other than media hype telling consumers that this is what they wanted, because it was a status symbol (like so many names before it). It's doesn't even fucking play in STEREO correctly.

Much to my dismay, everyone around me (excluding the bass player in my band), has fallen prey to this ad-campaign and been completely won over. I've heard them say "I don't know what I'd do without my iPod."

Meanwhile, I have my amazingly outdated matching home and portable CD players, with more functionality, true stereo, and superior D/A (as well as external D/A options).
I must add that I acquired them long ago, at a garage sale for 1/8th the price of an iPod Shuffle.

I stand at the window looking at the party inside, and wonder- Why am I the only person who realized that the building is on fire? Fuck it, I'll let them call 911.

[lyman]

hopefully downloading songs will kill lame collections of songs put together in a long playing format to make some extra money.

good point. maybe it will encourage artists/labels to cut out some fat.

[A-Barr]

It's doesn't even fucking play in STEREO correctly.

It doesn't???



I agree with thetathetatheta.... about the best minds stuff, however I think at a certain point, the "no expense spared/we'll worry about the future later" attitude caught up with them (PCB's, DDT, lead, mercury, asbestos, etc..) Not that the latter part of the mindset has really changed that much (depleted uranium, plastics, lead, mercury....

Although case in point, to back up thetathetathetathetatheta, I just got a "product update" email from Texas Instruments about new ultra-low-power 12 and 14 bit ADC's. Great. More cheap and crappy sound for the world to dispose of.

[Randy]

The other side of that is what happens when I'm listening to iTunes/iPod--I put it in shuffle mode and let it do its thing. I've heard much more of my music collection, and gotten more familiar with it, than I had in the few years prior where I tended to just pull out the 15 or so "favorite" CDs all the time.

Agreed.

This effect has made me interested in listening to whole albums that I haven't heard in a long time, or never got into as an album. If anything my iPod and Shuffle have made me listen to more music and more whole albums. It's really opened up my collection.

[tomberdude]

It's doesn't even fucking play in STEREO correctly.

It doesn't???

Not the 3 I am around and subjected to on the road. It sounds like it stereo summed to mono, but i'm still uncertain what it truly is. The example i'll use is what originally brought this issue to my attention.

A now defunct band from my area, Chronic Chaos, has a CD called "Wait To Watch Me Burn" (Unbiased Records). There are two guitars panned L-R, and every now and then a third supporting track in the center. Toms are spread out L-C-R accordingly. Blahblahblah, i'm probably wrong since i haven't heard the actual CD's in years, and rarely on the iPod when shuffle brings em up.

Either way, I first noticed a guitar was missing during harmonized guitar leads (something frequent for that band). It was stuff that was panned outward was gone. also, the mix was fucked up because of what I am assuming was some sort of mid-side processing during mastering.

Then I started noticing alot of other tracks from other bands, underground or major, doing the same things. So I tested all 3 of the iPods that play in our tour van. It didn't matter how the song was ripped from the CD, it didn't matter if the iPod was ran through a radio transmitter or headphone out to rca L-R or headphone out to Tape. I even checked the receiver and speaker wiring in the van. No matter what I tested, same results with the iPod involved.

My previously mentioned portable CD player, my portable MiniDisc player, the CD player in the van- no problems whatsoever, regardless of how they were routed to the transmitter.

So one must conclude, the problem came from the iPod.

[A-Barr]

It's doesn't even fucking play in STEREO correctly.

It doesn't???

Not the 3 I am around and subjected to on the road. It sounds like it stereo summed to mono, but i'm still uncertain what it truly is. The example i'll use is what originally brought this issue to my attention.

A now defunct band from my area, Chronic Chaos, has a CD called "Wait To Watch Me Burn" (Unbiased Records). There are two guitars panned L-R, and every now and then a third supporting track in the center. Toms are spread out L-C-R accordingly. Blahblahblah, i'm probably wrong since i haven't heard the actual CD's in years, and rarely on the iPod when shuffle brings em up.

Either way, I first noticed a guitar was missing during harmonized guitar leads (something frequent for that band). It was stuff that was panned outward was gone. also, the mix was fucked up because of what I am assuming was some sort of mid-side processing during mastering.

Then I started noticing alot of other tracks from other bands, underground or major, doing the same things. So I tested all 3 of the iPods that play in our tour van. It didn't matter how the song was ripped from the CD, it didn't matter if the iPod was ran through a radio transmitter or headphone out to rca L-R or headphone out to Tape. I even checked the receiver and speaker wiring in the van. No matter what I tested, same results with the iPod involved.

My previously mentioned portable CD player, my portable MiniDisc player, the CD player in the van- no problems whatsoever, regardless of how they were routed to the transmitter.

So one must conclude, the problem came from the iPod.

Crazy! If that's the case, I would have to change my vote to "Yes, the iPod is killing many albums."

[brainfreezebob]

It's doesn't even fucking play in STEREO correctly.

It doesn't???

Not the 3 I am around and subjected to on the road. It sounds like it stereo summed to mono, but i'm still uncertain what it truly is. The example i'll use is what originally brought this issue to my attention.

A now defunct band from my area, Chronic Chaos, has a CD called "Wait To Watch Me Burn" (Unbiased Records). There are two guitars panned L-R, and every now and then a third supporting track in the center. Toms are spread out L-C-R accordingly. Blahblahblah, i'm probably wrong since i haven't heard the actual CD's in years, and rarely on the iPod when shuffle brings em up.

Either way, I first noticed a guitar was missing during harmonized guitar leads (something frequent for that band). It was stuff that was panned outward was gone. also, the mix was fucked up because of what I am assuming was some sort of mid-side processing during mastering.

Then I started noticing alot of other tracks from other bands, underground or major, doing the same things. So I tested all 3 of the iPods that play in our tour van. It didn't matter how the song was ripped from the CD, it didn't matter if the iPod was ran through a radio transmitter or headphone out to rca L-R or headphone out to Tape. I even checked the receiver and speaker wiring in the van. No matter what I tested, same results with the iPod involved.

My previously mentioned portable CD player, my portable MiniDisc player, the CD player in the van- no problems whatsoever, regardless of how they were routed to the transmitter.

So one must conclude, the problem came from the iPod.

Are you sure all three of your band mates didn't have a Chinatown iPod knock-off? My iPod certainly plays in stereo, and it sounds a hell of a lot better than the flimsy Sony portable CD player it replaced.

When it comes down to it, though, I think it's perfectly justifiable that sound quality takes a backseat to the idea of carrying EVERY SONG YOU OWN in your pocket, everywhere.

When I'm at home, I listen to CDs and LPs. When I'm away, I listen to my iPod. The only thing that has changed for me is that I no longer spend an hour freaking out about what 15 albums I'm going to take with me when I have to go out of town.

[tomberdude]

Are you sure all three of your band mates didn't have a Chinatown iPod knock-off?Are you sure all three of your band mates didn't have a Chinatown iPod knock-off?

Yes. Unless Best-Buy is trying to cut costs and go to considerable lengths to cover it up.

When it comes down to it, though, I think it's perfectly justifiable that sound quality takes a backseat to the idea of carrying EVERY SONG YOU OWN in your pocket, everywhere.

I can agree, but MiniDisc, other less hipster mp3 players, and such can still hold considerable amounts of information.

When I'm at home, I listen to CDs and LPs. When I'm away, I listen to my iPod. The only thing that has changed for me is that I no longer spend an hour freaking out about what 15 albums I'm going to take with me when I have to go out of town.

Well, I have implemented a routine of making exact copies of all CD's any of us in the band get (as soon they're opened), and burning them to CD-Rs which get added to already 600 some album collection for the van. That way the original never gets abused, and we have an exact copy ready for replication when the CD-R becomes scratched/unusable (Thanks for high volume cheap external drives!)

If one wanted to argue the shuffle aspect, I will lose that. However, when you are traveling 100 mi.+ regularly without stopping, changing the CD is great for getting some muscle movement, and it seems to make time pass a little faster. AND I still get to hear the CD as it was intended to be heard.

Wait, are we there already?

[nicholas]

Having an ipod makes listening to albums in their entirety a lot more convenient for me since I'm out and about a lot. I can listen to full albums while I ride my bike, or whatever I'm doing outside the house.

[TheShaggyFox]

I know for a fact that my Ipod plays in Stereo. I guess I must be an exception!

[mertmo]

The stereo thing that you are hearing, Destroy Big Brother, is probably a tiny little setting in the "importing" section of the advanced preferences. When you rip CD's, the default setting (unless you change it) for the AAC encoder is "auto". But you can also set it to "mono" or "stereo". The "auto" setting is designed to create smaller files, it is a horrible little function that contributes to much of what people hate about MP3's. It analyzes the stereo program for sounds that it determines to be redundant between the left and right channels. When it finds them, it throws half of them away and has some code that allows the one side's information to be recreated for both sides when the file is played. NO BUENO! Go into your preferences -> advanced -> importing, then change your settings to "stereo". At least you will be preserving SOME of what the default setup is trying to throw away...

This is just my theory about what you are hearing. I never tried to test the difference myself, but when I read that (and I can't remember where), It disturbed me and I re-ripped my whole collection again at the highest bit rate possible (320) and reset the AAC settings to "stereo"!