Adventures in Modern Recording (or, Learning to Mic an Amp)
Adventures in Modern Recording (or, Learning to Mic an Amp)
After reading Justin Foley's post over in the "modeling vs. micing" thread, I did some experimenting with my amp and some mics. I'm a home recording "enthusiast" and while I don't have a million hours logged behind the board yet, I do have a good ear and know what I want to hear. I've noticed from time to time that my recorded track doesn't seem to capture "what the amp sounds like" and have figured I could do better. This is probably old hat to those of you who have been in the trenches for years, but it was one of those "aha!" moments that is so important to learning real and useful things.
I set up a condenser mic that I am familiar with (CAD GXL2200) about six inches from one speaker of my 2x12 combo, facing it straight on, not worrying too much about where on the speaker it was placed. I was using a clean, clear tone with full lows and a bit of jangle in the high-end. Playback was what I was used to hearing from previous experience - not much low end and a bit on the brittle side. Noted.
I moved the mic straight back about a foot, played the same bit, expecting to begin to hear a bit more room and hoping for some low-end - it did sound more diffuse, but not much. Overall pretty similar. Noted.
Back one more foot, it took on a slightly hollow sound - comb filtering? - and had a bit more "off in the distance" sound. Of course it was quieter, too, but I was mostly interested in the tonal changes. Still not much low-end. Okay.
I moved it back one more foot (at about 4 feet away now) and didn't hear the hollowness. I started to wonder if there could be some phase interference from the sounds of each speaker getting to the mic at slightly different times. I've encountered that with multiple mics on a single source before, but hadn't considered multiple sources into a single mic... it could happen, right?
So after reversing the process and moving the mic back up on the amp (with similar sonic results along the way), I tried turning the mic so the diaphragm was at a 45 degree angle to the speaker (pointing at the edge of the cabinet, basically). I figured if it helped with sibilance on vocals, it might reduce some of the crispiness here too. And it sure did! It was much smoother in the midrange, not nearly as sizzly, and a pleasant sound I would actually use. Check!
For an experiment with the phasing issue, I tried turning the mic do it was pointed 45 degreee off-speaker in the other direction - towards the other speaker, more or less. And there it was - all hollow and nasal! So that's one thing to keep in mind with a 2x12 and an omni mic, I guess!
I had also previously tried an SM57 and not been thrilled with it. But today I wanted to see what I could get out of it, so I put that up, pointed right at the cone, about four inches back. Plenty of definition, plenty of low end, not the most brilliant shimmery sound, but I liked it immediately and geez, I don't know what I was doing wrong before. Maybe it was just the sweet spot?
Anyway, I wanted to share my experience, perhaps to encourage the newer recordists, reassure the more experienced ones , and acknowledge the many useful tips, ideas, advice and amusements of the TapeOp board. Good stuff!
I set up a condenser mic that I am familiar with (CAD GXL2200) about six inches from one speaker of my 2x12 combo, facing it straight on, not worrying too much about where on the speaker it was placed. I was using a clean, clear tone with full lows and a bit of jangle in the high-end. Playback was what I was used to hearing from previous experience - not much low end and a bit on the brittle side. Noted.
I moved the mic straight back about a foot, played the same bit, expecting to begin to hear a bit more room and hoping for some low-end - it did sound more diffuse, but not much. Overall pretty similar. Noted.
Back one more foot, it took on a slightly hollow sound - comb filtering? - and had a bit more "off in the distance" sound. Of course it was quieter, too, but I was mostly interested in the tonal changes. Still not much low-end. Okay.
I moved it back one more foot (at about 4 feet away now) and didn't hear the hollowness. I started to wonder if there could be some phase interference from the sounds of each speaker getting to the mic at slightly different times. I've encountered that with multiple mics on a single source before, but hadn't considered multiple sources into a single mic... it could happen, right?
So after reversing the process and moving the mic back up on the amp (with similar sonic results along the way), I tried turning the mic so the diaphragm was at a 45 degree angle to the speaker (pointing at the edge of the cabinet, basically). I figured if it helped with sibilance on vocals, it might reduce some of the crispiness here too. And it sure did! It was much smoother in the midrange, not nearly as sizzly, and a pleasant sound I would actually use. Check!
For an experiment with the phasing issue, I tried turning the mic do it was pointed 45 degreee off-speaker in the other direction - towards the other speaker, more or less. And there it was - all hollow and nasal! So that's one thing to keep in mind with a 2x12 and an omni mic, I guess!
I had also previously tried an SM57 and not been thrilled with it. But today I wanted to see what I could get out of it, so I put that up, pointed right at the cone, about four inches back. Plenty of definition, plenty of low end, not the most brilliant shimmery sound, but I liked it immediately and geez, I don't know what I was doing wrong before. Maybe it was just the sweet spot?
Anyway, I wanted to share my experience, perhaps to encourage the newer recordists, reassure the more experienced ones , and acknowledge the many useful tips, ideas, advice and amusements of the TapeOp board. Good stuff!
Last edited by Jpp on Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:51 am, edited 3 times in total.
- JGriffin
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I especially liked the single off that record, "Video Also Killed The Radio Star's Agent, Drummer and Two Guys Selling Bootleg T-shirts on the Corner Outside the Venue."
"Jeweller, you've failed. Jeweller."
"Lots of people are nostalgic for analog. I suspect they're people who never had to work with it." ? Brian Eno
All the DWLB music is at http://dwlb.bandcamp.com/
"Lots of people are nostalgic for analog. I suspect they're people who never had to work with it." ? Brian Eno
All the DWLB music is at http://dwlb.bandcamp.com/
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I was a beatnik!dwlb wrote:I especially liked the single off that record, "Video Also Killed The Radio Star's Agent, Drummer and Two Guys Selling Bootleg T-shirts on the Corner Outside the Venue."
I was a beatnik!
I was a beatnik!
I was a beatnik!
AH wuzzuh BEATnik!!
?What need is there to weep over parts of life? The whole of it calls for tears.? -- Seneca
Follow-up single... er, mp3: "The iPod Killed the Album Star" (as seen on TOMB!)
Michael: my favorite sound was about two feet away. Closer was useful too, and had a more immediate "right there" sound.
Spent some time with a 57 yesterday and found out that sweet spots DO exist and an inch really CAN make a difference. Not that I had any doubt.
Beatnik beatnik beatnik!
Jpp
Michael: my favorite sound was about two feet away. Closer was useful too, and had a more immediate "right there" sound.
Spent some time with a 57 yesterday and found out that sweet spots DO exist and an inch really CAN make a difference. Not that I had any doubt.
Beatnik beatnik beatnik!
Jpp
*takes thread onstage with Yes in front of skeptical UK crowds*
I like the idea of the space being part of the recording, be it my basement or inside a stone castle with fancy gear. I have the amp a couple feet off the floor in the center of the room, and we've done no deadening aside from the carpet, throw pillows and guitar cases. It's not especially reflective, but it has what I refer to as "a cozy suburban ambience" for drums. So I'm sure reflections are part of the equation - capturing the right ones is part of the process as I'm finding! (note to self: try amp against a wall soon)
Condenser @ 2 ft --> toolbox.
Jpp
I like the idea of the space being part of the recording, be it my basement or inside a stone castle with fancy gear. I have the amp a couple feet off the floor in the center of the room, and we've done no deadening aside from the carpet, throw pillows and guitar cases. It's not especially reflective, but it has what I refer to as "a cozy suburban ambience" for drums. So I'm sure reflections are part of the equation - capturing the right ones is part of the process as I'm finding! (note to self: try amp against a wall soon)
Condenser @ 2 ft --> toolbox.
Jpp
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