A wiring question

[christopher dwyer]

Hello!
kinda got a problem with some wiring in my basement studio, just seeing if anyone can point me in the right direction?

We were doing some guitar tracks and we had an amp blow on us, like the circuit board blew in the amp. we were like what the heck.

Another problem we had a band was practicing and his guitar cabinet caught on fire, one of the speakers actually caught on fire.

Then another amp blew, i think the tubes went on it, but i can't really tell.

I had a friend who is an electrician come over and take a look at our outlets and control box, he says that there is no ground on any of the outlets, i was wondering if this could be the problem we were having with all our amps? He also said back in the 50's (when this house was built) that they never grounded anything back then.

Not really sure what to do with this situation, but my bands i scared to play down theri because they don't want their amps destroyed even more.

any advice?

thanks

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www.myspace.com/thegatsbyrecording
www.myspace.com/thebitterlifetypecast

[KilledByAlbany]

Having an improperly grounded room probably wouldn't cause this, but if you are having intermittent power surges and don't have a safe path to ground, I can't imagine it would help.

Do you have a multimeter handy? If so check the voltage at your wall sockets, just to verify that you are getting steady and normal voltage. It's unlikely, but possible that you might be plugging into a 250v circuit, normally used for washing machines and other heavy current draws. (Normal wall AC should be 125v) 250v circuits don't generally use the same style plug, which is why I find it unlikely, but old houses can have a host of wiring weirdness that you normally wouldn't run into in a sane installation.

Do you have a box of circuit breakers, or just the old style fuses? If it's the latter, I would pop the fuses out and make sure that nobody has left a penny smoldering away behind them. Another fun thing you come across in prewar houses.

Glad to see the Bitter Life Typecast is still around, by the way. I thought I heard you guys had broken up a while ago. I'm actually in the middle of working on MikeOhFive's new bands demo right now, weirdly enough.

[GooberNumber9]

I'm confused, the outlets you have don't have a safety ground, yet you are able to plug modern amps into them? That to me smells like someone is defeating the third pin of their amp power somehow. That is very unwise and dangerous. I would say you are lucky that only amps have been fried, and no people so far.

I myself will not plug my amp into an outlet until I've tested it with one of those $15 Home Depot testers and found it good. Not because of the amp, but because it's my life on the line.

The best solution is to get proper wiring installed by a competent electrician. Every outlet available should have a safety ground that is properly connected. If someone gets electrocuted in your house you will probably be liable, and you might even face criminal charges.

BTW, if the house was wired in the 50's you may have aluminum wiring, which is another issue because it was not always rated correctly for current, and/or someone may have installed improperly rated fuses or breakers that are designed for copper wiring. Get a pro in there to help you make sure it's all safe.

Todd Wilcox

[christopher dwyer]

hey,
the outlets look like normal outlets, when we opened them up there was no ground wire connected to the outlet.
My friend said he could just put some ground wire into each outlet....
Don't know if thats the best option or not.
I'm not a electrian or know anything about tha sorta thing.

Hey Andrew, yeah mike told me you were recording the new Might demo, i'm trying to get him to come down here and record with his new band with eric on drums.

[radiationroom]

If you are not 100% sure of what you are doing, call a pro. In PA, your fire insurance can be ruled void if your DIY wiring job causes your place to burn to the ground. Just FYI.

73's - Peter Carli

[Wire]

thegatsby,

there most likely is a ground as the reason they didn't have or need a ground is the boxes that were used were metal as well the armored (BX) cabling had a metal jacket and the outlet screws in to the metal box and make contact which is common to "ground pin" on the outlet. Then at the panel, the panel is grounded and the BX is all clamped into the panel which ties the ground there.

But ground or no ground things shouldn't be frying... could be a incorrectly wired outlet, which should be tested and some one mentioned about a tester from home depot (a great idea) you plug it in and it tells you the exact problem if any.

Power surges sound pretty familiar here especially as older vintage pieces can't take the variation as newer gear can. A Surgex line conditioner/surge suppressor will do the job nicely we use them alot in our installs and they work great and Surgex says to date they have NEVER had one fail due to a power surge.

But definitely have a electrician check it out either way.

[radiationroom]

thegatsby,there most likely is a ground as the reason they didn't have or need a ground is the boxes that were used were metal as well the armored (BX) cabling had a metal jacket and the outlet screws in to the metal box and make contact which is common to "ground pin" on the outlet. Then at the panel, the panel is grounded and the BX is all clamped into the panel which ties the ground there.

WARNING: In many jurisdictions, when running armored (BX) cable, a separate ground wire is still required. If you are doing a new install and are running armored wire, make sure that the green or bare wire is connected to the appropriate grounding points on each end. Never assume that box-clamps will provide an secure ground, because box clamps are designed to insure mechanical reliability of the circuit but are not intended to carry current under any condition. Only a property connected "green wire" or equivalent bare wire can do that.

Surgex says to date they have NEVER had one fail due to a power surge.

I have a SurgeX SX20NE on my power circuit, and it has saved my butt on at least one occasion that I know of.

BUT!!! The SurgeX, like any product, has it's limitations, and it will only be a matter of time until one fails in the field. That is why I still disconnect my production rig from the powerline when it is not in use and during thunderstorms. Still, I will personally endorse the SurgeX product if you are hesitant about investing in one.

The best overvoltage protection (if you can afford it) is still those old Sola ferro-rez 2:1 transformers that regulate voltage using core saturation. And even then I wouldn't claim that you'd be lightning proof.