inserts / balancing / patchbays

Recording Techniques, People Skills, Gear, Recording Spaces, Computers, and DIY

Moderators: drumsound, tomb

Post Reply
User avatar
chuckfurok
steve albini likes it
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:49 pm
Location: ABQ
Contact:

inserts / balancing / patchbays

Post by chuckfurok » Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:20 pm

Not sure if this should be in gear talk or not.....

So I have a Digimax FS in the mail to me and I have been thinking about how to hook it up. One reason I was excited about this piece of gear (besides not having to have anything made by behringer in my signal chain) is that by using the inserts you can bypass the pre-amps. But if I do this it will be unbalanced right? If I have all 8 inserts routed to my patchbay (oh crap that's behringer!) that is half-normalled does my signal become unbalanced even if nothing is patched in?

Along the same lines if I have the inserts on my console all routed to a patchbay does the resulting signal become unbalanced or does it get rebalanced somehow? Is there such a thing as balanced inserts?

I am thinking about this correctly? I am not super paranoid about everything being balanced but would like it to be if possible.

User avatar
chuckfurok
steve albini likes it
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:49 pm
Location: ABQ
Contact:

Post by chuckfurok » Tue Feb 12, 2008 3:20 pm

Further research leads me to see that almost all inserts are not balanced. But perhaps my console rebalances the signal some how. But the digimax probably does not I would guess.

User avatar
chuckfurok
steve albini likes it
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:49 pm
Location: ABQ
Contact:

Post by chuckfurok » Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:15 pm

Due to the overwhelming feedback I have gotten on this thread I thought I would add some more questions and thoughts.

I figured out that I cannot put the inserts on my
digimax into a balanced patchbay. In order for an
unbalanced insert to be normalled the tip has to
connect to ring. right? And this is not possible on a
balanced patchbay because ring is normalled to ring
and tip is normalled to tip and they do not cross.

I have to get an unbalanced patchbay for inserts. Is this correct?

japmn
suffering 'studio suck'
Posts: 448
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:53 pm
Location: Chicago

Post by japmn » Wed Feb 27, 2008 8:20 am

Incorrect.
Tip never connects to ring. In order to un-ballance your TRS connector you connect ring to sleeve. you can connect inserts to a ballanced patchbay and it will work fine. I do it all the time. You are overthinking the inportance of the signal becoming unballanced ate the insert. It causes little to no problem that you will notice. The insert jack itself is a normaled connection.

ashcat_lt
tinnitus
Posts: 1094
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 1:54 pm
Location: Duluth, MN
Contact:

Post by ashcat_lt » Wed Feb 27, 2008 11:59 am

If you really wanted to run the insert cables to the back of the patchbay in some permanent installation, you'd just have to use an insert cable (TRS>2xTS) and put the return above the send. Then they're normalled together.

Of course, you've just extended the signal path of your mixer with a whole bunch of wire when you don't need inserts. I usually just plug in the insert cable when I need it and run it to the front of the patchbay.

japmn
suffering 'studio suck'
Posts: 448
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:53 pm
Location: Chicago

Post by japmn » Wed Feb 27, 2008 12:10 pm

ashcat_lt wrote:I usually just plug in the insert cable when I need it and run it to the front of the patchbay.
Exactly.

User avatar
chuckfurok
steve albini likes it
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:49 pm
Location: ABQ
Contact:

Post by chuckfurok » Wed Feb 27, 2008 12:56 pm

ashcat_lt wrote:If you really wanted to run the insert cables to the back of the patchbay in some permanent installation, you'd just have to use an insert cable (TRS>2xTS) and put the return above the send. Then they're normalled together.
The thing is I tried this and then the mic pres would not pass signal. I double checked that they were set to normal. It may just be the piece of shite behringer patch bay. Thanks for your inputs.

I also would like to have the inserts on the patchbay A. because the insert jacks are on the back of the digimax and a pain to get to and B. I would like to be able to bypass the pres using the return of the insert.

japmn
suffering 'studio suck'
Posts: 448
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:53 pm
Location: Chicago

Post by japmn » Wed Feb 27, 2008 5:33 pm

Does the Patch bay have the cards that you flip to change the normal? A friend of mine has a Nady patch bay and the function does not work on half of the cards. IF I were y?u I would spring for a better (Neutrik/switchcraft) patch bay. They can go for fairly cheep on Ebay. I got 2 Neutrik bays and 4 30', 12 ch. Snakes for $60.

Score!

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 38 guests