Wow-- is it really that easy?

Recording Techniques, People Skills, Gear, Recording Spaces, Computers, and DIY

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jv
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Post by jv » Mon Jun 16, 2008 5:33 pm

RefD wrote:wait, Matt LeBlanc is fronting Cowboy Mouse?
Yeah, they're a tribute band - they do country western versions of Modest Mouse songs.

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Post by RefD » Mon Jun 16, 2008 6:01 pm

jv wrote:
RefD wrote:wait, Matt LeBlanc is fronting Cowboy Mouse?
Yeah, they're a tribute band - they do country western versions of Modest Mouse songs.
Mick Mars is so good in that band!

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Post by DrummerMan » Wed Jun 18, 2008 11:02 pm

TapeOpLarry wrote:All the Cowboy Mouth CDs that anyone paid for were done in a "real" studio I'll bet...
Is this in fact true?

I'm not disputing it, necessarily. I just don't know.

And I'm not trying to throw my support behind Fox News, believe me... Or Cowboy Mouth for that matter (I could really care less about them).

I'm just curious if music recorded in this guy's home studio (which obviously cost more than $500), or other similar somewhat mid-level artists' home studios, aren't the records of theirs that people buy, listen to, and enjoy en masse?
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turtlejon1
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Post by turtlejon1 » Thu Jun 19, 2008 9:50 pm

looks like a 414 and an 002. $500....
and "Iron Horse" i think was the bluegrass covers of modes mouse, really well done...
-always thankful-

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Post by thecheat » Tue Jun 24, 2008 10:25 pm

There were a pair of Distressors in there too.... ill take em...

Is it bad that i judge other studios based on how much gear I would steal given the opportunity?

Yeah probably.

Chris
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Post by BusyBoxSt7 » Fri Nov 14, 2008 9:10 am

Where did the guy get the figure $1-2000 (!) a day for a "decent" recording studio?!?!? Wouldn't "decent" be more like $500 or less in many cities? They should have titled it, "Are you a musician who is totally illiterate?" (rates on the internet). haha.

that guitar tone was amazing by the way (wink)...

wait I can think of some "self-recorded" artists. hmm. Spoon, John Vanderslice, Death Cab. yeah, not much over $500 of gear and a nominal/average amount of musical experience... laughing all the way home.
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Post by eliya » Sat Nov 15, 2008 9:57 am

I don't write much in this forum, but I do occasionally read here, especially in the "buy/sell/trade" section.

I don't get what you guys are complaining about. Probably 90% of the engineers in the last 25 years started out by recording themselves and others on shitty consumer grade equipment. It was ok because they were using reel-to-reel 4 tracks and 8 tracks?

No one would buy any piece of equipment if Fox News said "well, you can't record stuff that sound decent with this equipment, but it'll be passable". They have to say it sounds "awesome" or else no one would care about it, I mean no one who's out of the music recording circle.

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Post by BusyBoxSt7 » Sat Nov 15, 2008 11:48 am

duh. we're probably all complaining because we own studios that to one degree or another are stocked w/ crazy equipment and a lot of experience and we all talk to bands every week who say, "i think we're going to try to record it ourselves" and most of those recordings come out really lame (and obviously we lose a customer in the shortrun at least)
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Brian
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Post by Brian » Sat Nov 15, 2008 10:04 pm

I'm glad for the homerecording boom! All those bands I recorded and told them "don't use my name in the credits", I won't have to think about that anymore.
Harumph!

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Post by rwc » Sun Nov 16, 2008 1:48 am

stompforfuzz wrote:"prepare to shell out $150.00 for a decent pair of speakers"

Holy crap, I can get a decent pair of monitors for $150.00?!?


It's the Truth, I swears!

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/ ... sku=600602
A lot of people don't even care. I bet half this board uses cheapo monitors, from what I read, in rooms that are barely treated, right up against a wall.

I don't mean this in a bad way. But when a lot of people who do something do it a certain way, the average joe(which is what fox people are - they're not journalists in the least, in this case) will think that's how it's done.

When I was 15, I got a real stereo for my birthday.. my first real stereo. It was one of those CD/tape/radio all in one things from best buy, with two speakers and a middle unit. It cost about $209.

How people expect pro studio monitors for less confuses me.

As for the content of the video, I think it is ridiculous.

There are two types of news stories.

The kind where they have a punchline, and get you to watch all the shitty "news" in order to get to the cool "news" at the end of the show. The punchline winds up being better than the story, which in addition to not being interesting, isn't even true.

and REAL news.

the former is typically dominant on commercial networks. wonder why :roll:

It's why I stopped watching most televised news.

This is no different.

I think being an artist is a life pursuit. I think engineering is really a life pursuit. The people who are great at both, IMO, certainly dived head first into one or the other at a given point in time, and spent time on it.

For the most part, the successful artist(sales, grammys, etc) didn't go to the store, spend $500 on pro tools LE, and make a platinum record.
Real friends stab you in the front.

Oscar Wilde

Failed audio engineer & pro studio tech turned Component level motherboard repair store in New York

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Post by eliya » Sun Nov 16, 2008 6:16 am

BusyBoxSt7 wrote:duh. we're probably all complaining because we own studios that to one degree or another are stocked w/ crazy equipment and a lot of experience and we all talk to bands every week who say, "i think we're going to try to record it ourselves" and most of those recordings come out really lame (and obviously we lose a customer in the shortrun at least)
No Offense, I never heard your recordings, but maybe your not doing a good job? And a good job is more than making good recordings. People here are always ranting how band the music they're recording and how, how idiotic are the musicians and what not. I won't be surprised if most people here are sitting behind the console making a face as if someone too a dump on their console. It's the attitude of "pro" studios that's driving people to record in their homes.

I don't have a commercial studio, but I guess you can call it pro, if you judge by the gear.

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Post by rwc » Sun Nov 16, 2008 7:01 am

it's kind of like teachers sitting in the lounge telling stories.

as if they'd like the job if only no students were involved.

or doctors who love the work but dislike speaking to, or dealing with patients.

EARTH TO DORIS: THAT IS THE JOB!!!

Earlier on I'd bitch about a singer, or a band member, or a whole band, if something went weird on their part. I thought they were to blame. Whether it was performance issue, or sonic.

I was being a novice.

I didn't know that maybe the reason it doesn't sound the way it should, or he is not performing as good, is because the headphone mix could've sucked.

I could have been mixing it ALL WRONG and completely fucking it up. But he doesn't know what I was doing to fuck it up. It is my job to translate what's in his head to the record.

I could have been going for total isolation when in the room with PA monitors was totally what was needed.

Or I wasn't moving the way the guy was used to moving in a writing session with the same quickness in workflow as the guy's prior engineer. People DO get workflows together when they work with another AE for a while, and they begin to expect it the next time.

Think of yourself as the client. I would think of myself as a client when I go to get a haircut. I get a weird haircut. I have to explain it each time to the lady there, what I want.

If she's doing something wrong, I will state so.

I don't feel I'm being a dick by stating it, but I have to state it or I'll have fucked up hair.

Or maybe I explain to them what I want and they find that I'm being ridiculous. But all I want is what I believe to be a simple haircut.

Sometimes I'm sure they literally bitch inside their head "man I wish this guy could just get a 5 buzzcut like everyone else and call it a fukking day"

to them, they'd love cutting hair if not for people.

To others, they say "oh, ok", smile, do it that way, strike up conversation, and do a good job. I give them a nice tip and request them next time.

The former lady, even if it WOUND UP being a good job, I do NOT go to her again. I know it will be a pain in the ass to explain what I want done, I know she will misinterpret what I want done and then proceed to act pissy. I know she will under her breath wish I had done something simpler.

Even if it winds up being a good job, when I walk in, there's five people there waiting to cut my hair. So I'm going to the one that made me feel most at ease.

Hint: there's more than 5000 people coming out of school every F%$^NG YEAR BEGGING TO DO BAND A'S RECORD FOR $50 AND BEER!

So, obviously, this attitude isn't helping.



The former lady typically doesn't show up anymore, and has quit for good and gone off to a(probably better paying) new career. and the good one, is still there, smiling when I come in and asking how I've been.

How many parallels can you draw between the scenario I described above and the engineer?

The statement, Dysfunction: Ever notice how the one common factor in all of your failed relationships is you? came to mind with me.

There are many things one might be doing wrong, in a session that doesn't go well. It doesn't even have to man you're BAD at what you DO. It may just mean, you don't know enough about that facet of the craft yet. Or maybe that's simply NOT your niche, or what you got into it for.

But don't fool yourself into thinking the band's at fault until you've exhausted every option within. Blaming others provides one with a scapegoat: blaming yourself provides you with self improvement.

At this point I think I've gotten pretty good at knowing the bullshit ratio between the engineer and the band - how much exists on each side of the glass, if any. I've found a surprising amount I(and others) thought was the other side of the glass wound up being me.
Real friends stab you in the front.

Oscar Wilde

Failed audio engineer & pro studio tech turned Component level motherboard repair store in New York

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Brian
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Post by Brian » Sun Nov 16, 2008 8:44 am

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Last edited by Brian on Sun Nov 16, 2008 8:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
Harumph!

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Brian
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Post by Brian » Sun Nov 16, 2008 8:45 am

I knew there was a reason I liked you!

Dysfunction. Brilliant.

NYC people, READ:

People manifest themselves differently an react to things mostly, real thought is beyond most, most of the time, what they have is knee jerk reactions to whatever is in front of them in every situation. Conventional education is supposed to circumvent this animalistic behavior but nothing in it is specifically designed to do so.
I used to have a client who had a clear vision of what he wanted, his previous producer knew and clued me in, because, this guy could not verbally communicate what he wanted. Oh, he tried, but, nope.
Working with him was like going on five million fishing trips to get one specific fish.
Once I figured out his "mode" I could hook him up in minutes. It was bewildering, but, I made it through. We went through reels of tape together.
He was out of "The Actor's Studio" and highly regarded there for his talent. He was talented. Classic tortured artist syndrome.
I won't give his name but, I will tell you this, the producer two producers back said, "You have this Lou Reed thing happening and I want to bring it out". Alright NYC folks, I know you know who that producer was, care to take a guess?
I love that guy, he's a rock!

I worked with him out of my house on an 8 track reel for 2 years. I sent his woman the tapes.
Deck, small mixer, drum machine, keyboard, guitar, amp, headphone amp, NS10's. = $6.5k

Those sessions obviously never went anywhere. That's the game, to have so many clients going on that the good ones, that give you a headache, and drop off the face of the earth don't slow you down. I had plenty of loser projects. I hung on to them for something, especially if I knew they weren't going anywhere, just to learn more about how to subvert the propagation of dysfunction by the artist.
If they are dedicated to dysfunction, once you effectively stop them from being able to dominate your sessions with it, they take a hike. You just have to make sure you do your dead level best on everyone so if they bitch about your ability to blame you for their shortcomings, it will be very obvious to anyone who they tell their tale of woe to.
I have worked with multiplatinum producers in their pre multiplatinum stage.
I think you can tell in the first 5 minutes if someone will go on to greatness or not. Not everyone who should be able to tell this can.
Harumph!

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