Voice / Acoustic Guitar Recording Techniques

[liftyrfists]

Hello there,
So, I've done mostly instrumental super-layered work until recently, and lately I've delved into more singer-songwriter-ish stuff, at least relatively to my what I've done before now.

Anyway, I haven't really tried yet, but I'm wondering how one would ideally mic this situation (recording vocals and guitar at the same time, rather than separate takes).

If you'd like to give me an ideal scenario, you're welcome to, but my equipment right now are just two oktava mc012s (with two omni caps) and two 57's. I've thought that it might work fine to just do some good placement with the mc012s and just see how the vocals and guitar mesh. I don't mind the vocals being not-up-front or further back in the mix, but just thought I'd throw the scenario out there anyway...

jon

[Sloan]

I've done this with a stereo pair on the guitar, one near the body, one near the neck and then a vocal mic close to the singer's mouth. I also took a DI from the electro/acoustic guitar. I almost hate acoustic DI's, but it's goot to have one to gently mix under the mics to add some note definition.

You can also just set up a mic a few feet away and leave it up to the performer to balance things out.

[lyle76]

i've had good luck with a well placed mid-side. Failing that i actually like the one well placed mic approach. depends on the player - experiment!

[lyle76]

i've had good luck with a well placed mid-side. Failing that i actually like the one well placed mic approach. depends on the player - experiment!

[drumsound]

Figure 8 is you're friend.

[oldguitars]

Figure 8 is you're friend.

+1

figure 8 is the best way to do this by far!

[HeavyHand]

Figure 8 is you're friend.

+1

figure 8 is the best way to do this by far!

how/where would you position it?

[red cross]

Omni is your friend as well.

[JWL]

I like 2 figure 8 mics placed in blumlein, sideways, in an equilateral triangle with the singer's mouth and the guitar's soundhole. This way the null of the guitar mic is pointed at the singer's mouth, and the null of the vocal mic is pointed at the guitar. Plus, the 2 signals are completely phase coherent.

I have both condenser and ribbon mics in figure 8, I try them both to see which sounds best. Often times, I end up with one of each.

This pair will give me most of my sound. From there I'll put up room mics as needed.

[shakestheclown]

The blumein thing works very well, however if you only have 2 oktavas and some 57s then that is not an option.

Spaced pair omnis.

Assuming your room sounds good... about a 4 foot triangle using the 2 omni mics and you subject.

Height will depend on whether your guy/girl is standing or sitting. Split the difference between the guitar and his/her mouth.

You could also try to use a 57 for just the vocals but you will probably have phase issues from off axis rejection from the 57.

[centurymantra]

There's some good suggestions here. The figure 8 mics can definitely be handy for this. I am working with a guy right now - a singer/songwriter type and we've done a couple songs where we did both vocals and guitar simultaneously. One thing I did that was kind of interesting is put a stereo pair of SDC mics (I think it was x/y) out front of him playing and singing - a good 4-6 ft. back. I had him sing quietly, with just enough force to get the feel of playing and singing. We then overdubbed a main vocal and the vocal on the stereo track basically acts as a subtle doubling that actually added a nice texture.

That being said, don't ignore the suggestion of one well placed mic. I ran into a situation with this guy where he was just passing time in between takes while I futzed around with something by singing and strumming a tune . This tune immediately caught my attention and I told him that "hey...that's really nice what is it? - Let's record it!" I threw up an M160, acting quick to catch the vibe and this single mic caught the greatest sound - a really nice blend of the vocal and guitar. It's totally raw and dark, but it does sound cool and we were able to catch the spontaneous performance, and this guy is kind of fan of that rustic sound. The funny thing is, he at first told me it was "probably some old Hank Williams tune" as he couldn't even remember what it was. Turns out that it was actually one of his old songs that he hadn't thought about in, like 10-15 years, and it was just dredged up out his subconciousness. He even found the lyrics to it when he went through some old notes. The song was cool enough that we decided to do something with it and I even convinced him to keep that original freeform take - warts and all.

Anyway....getting back to the point, I actually happen to have that tune posted on my site. You could listen to this as an example of a 'one mic' recording of this scenario. Given it's a ribbon mic, it is a particular sound, but should give you an idea. I was pleasantly surprised at how full sounding it is. A couple lines at the very end of the tune have an overdubbed vocal blended in to cover a flubbed word or two from the original take, but the majority of the guitar/vocal performance is from that one mic.



www.shoeshinestudio.com/music/JimMoore/Heaven.mp3

[Professor]

I agree - if all you have is a couple of Oktavas and 57s then that's what you're going to use. Fig-8s are indeed your friend in these sorts of arrangements, but unless you're planning on buying a few of them sometime soon, don't sweat it.

What did stand out to me though was that you mentioned not being concerned if the vocals are too far back. That's something I'd really caution against when you're recording & mixing your own songs. You know all of the lyrics so they could be almost inaudible in the song (or not even there) and your brain is going to put them in and hear them perfectly clear. But to the target audience listener, they probably want to hear and understand the lyrics. Unless you're doing some kind of exciting guitar work way beyond strumming G-D-C block chords, most listeners want to hear the words.
That said, you should make sure you have the ability to turn up the vocals vs. the guitar.
You could stay close and place the two condensers up near the guitar in whatever setup you like (I favor an XY in that kind of arrangement to minimize phase issues) and then place one of the 57s up real close (with a pop screen) to you face for the vocals. If you really want to go with your 'natural balance' then you could pull back the mics a couple feet and setup the condenser pair in XY, ORTF, or something like that. But you should still place a 57 each up close to the guitar & your face so that if you need to add a little extra to one or the other you'll have the signal in place to do it.

-Jeremy

[blackdiscoball]

I did a recording of a friend of mine and we went to his grandparants farm when they were away and recorded with a revox reel to reel. All I used was a sm58 on his voice, and the a LDC on his guitar. I just moved it around till I found something I liked and we recorded 4 songs like that. It turn out great, I went home and put it on my computer added a little compression, and a little eq on each mic and was very happy. Obviosly you dont need to go through all that but two mono mic's can do a great job.

p.s. that multilayered instrumental wouldnt be in the godspeed vein would it?

[Artifex]

Hey centurymantra- that link doesn't work for me.

[drumsound]

Figure 8 is you're friend.

+1

figure 8 is the best way to do this by far!

how/where would you position it?

I'll often use a figure 8 on the vocalwith the null pointed at the guitar. It keeps the voice pretty seperate for any neededor desired processing.

If goingfor a mono guitar another figure 8 with thenull pointed at the vocal.