Hi,
I just picked up a m460D pre/eq module. i'm going to throw on some xlr pig tails and just need to know what type of power supply I would need? i'm really a beginner, but I think I'm getting a handle in this. I have the pin-out harness/connector thing, and found some schematics of a very similar module.
http://wbsps.kuzub.com/PDFs/M460T%20-%2 ... 20Outs.pdf
What are the details that I need to look for in a power supply, and what's a good source online?
Does anyone have a recommendation, or any other tips? Thanks!
_andrew
what power supply for Ward Beck M460D ?
Ward Beck stuff is oddball. It runs on +/- 25 VDC. Lotsa stuff runs on either +24VDC (old German gear mostly, like Telefunken or Siemens) or +/- 16 VDC or so (stuff like API, Melcor, etc). Lookit the link you posted and you'll see the connection point for the mains. That 24V point is probably to run the lamps...just guessing, but it's likely.
Get a linear power supply that puts out +/- 24 VDC. Most of the basic ones (like Condor) have some adjustment on the output so you can increase the output of a 24V supply up over 28V or so. I don't know how much current one of these uses. Probably something on the order of 250-400 ma, but that's a guess. Mouser would be my first source for a simple linear power supply...
Get a linear power supply that puts out +/- 24 VDC. Most of the basic ones (like Condor) have some adjustment on the output so you can increase the output of a 24V supply up over 28V or so. I don't know how much current one of these uses. Probably something on the order of 250-400 ma, but that's a guess. Mouser would be my first source for a simple linear power supply...
I thought this club was for musicians. Who let the drummer in here??
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kuene
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pardon my bumping this, i'm not trying to be impatient - i just realized that i may have sounded like I was all set with the information provided so far (which was helpful). if anyone can point me to a specific power supply, it would be very helpful. when i browse these supply sites, i'm faced with a mountain of specs and variety, and I can't make heads or tails. I see some some power supplies going for $350 while others are $40 - $40 btw is what I've been told to expect for what I need. Im not concerned with ultra high quality here, this is more of a project, and i'm a lo-fi type of guy. thanks again all,
-a
-a
This one would work well. http://www.geocities.com/m_natsume/psu.html
He makes this for use with his 1176 boards. For those it'll do +30/-10, but as long as you put trimmer resistors for VR1 and VR2, you can simply adjust those for a +25/-25V reading. The parts list is right there on the page too. All the parts are easily available at mouser.
I'm not sure what kind of power transformer that the ward beck stuff will require, but look for a torroidal with a 24 V secondary and the appropriate amperage, and you should be good to go.
Here's his ordering info: http://www.prodigy-pro.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2912
Scroll down and you'll see that there is a minimum order of 4 boards for the little power supply, but who cares because they're only $4 Australian dollars each.
If you're unsure you can ask at prodigy pro and those guys will help you out too.
He makes this for use with his 1176 boards. For those it'll do +30/-10, but as long as you put trimmer resistors for VR1 and VR2, you can simply adjust those for a +25/-25V reading. The parts list is right there on the page too. All the parts are easily available at mouser.
I'm not sure what kind of power transformer that the ward beck stuff will require, but look for a torroidal with a 24 V secondary and the appropriate amperage, and you should be good to go.
Here's his ordering info: http://www.prodigy-pro.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2912
Scroll down and you'll see that there is a minimum order of 4 boards for the little power supply, but who cares because they're only $4 Australian dollars each.
If you're unsure you can ask at prodigy pro and those guys will help you out too.
Stilgar, we've got wormsign the likes of which God has never seen!
Racking old stuff is always more complicated than it may seem, particularly if it's not something you've done often (or ever...).
you can get an off the shelf supply. Look up Mouser #675-HAA24-0.6A-G
that would get you there for $50 or so. The stuff Jon linked to is DIY versions of power supplies that do work and would be cheaper to build, if you have the skill and knowledge. The caveat is "skills and knowledge". I'm of the mind that developing those two things on a complex rack job isn't the smartest way. Walk before you run, ya know?
I could be misjudging your skill level, so forgive me if that's the case. It's just that I see basic questions on such subjects often here. Kinda worries me a little. I'd hate to see someone hurt some nice gear or themselves through lack of knowledge. I also know a person needs to learn somehow and doing it is often the best way. There's lots of racking threads here and at that prodigy-pro site Jon linked, so do lots of research before you melt any solder. good luck...
you can get an off the shelf supply. Look up Mouser #675-HAA24-0.6A-G
that would get you there for $50 or so. The stuff Jon linked to is DIY versions of power supplies that do work and would be cheaper to build, if you have the skill and knowledge. The caveat is "skills and knowledge". I'm of the mind that developing those two things on a complex rack job isn't the smartest way. Walk before you run, ya know?
I could be misjudging your skill level, so forgive me if that's the case. It's just that I see basic questions on such subjects often here. Kinda worries me a little. I'd hate to see someone hurt some nice gear or themselves through lack of knowledge. I also know a person needs to learn somehow and doing it is often the best way. There's lots of racking threads here and at that prodigy-pro site Jon linked, so do lots of research before you melt any solder. good luck...
I thought this club was for musicians. Who let the drummer in here??
others have given some good advice. it can be a fun project but it won't be quick and easy.
i have had great luck with this PSU - it can be ordered as a kit or preassembled. ruel gives good support!
http://fivefishstudios.com/index.php?op ... &Itemid=62
i have had great luck with this PSU - it can be ordered as a kit or preassembled. ruel gives good support!
http://fivefishstudios.com/index.php?op ... &Itemid=62
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kuene
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i appreciate the words of caution. it sounds like the pre-assembled 25v kit from fivefish should be the ticket. then i suppose i need one of the power transformers. you can't underestimate my skill level. i know how to solder, and that's about it, in terms of tasks related to racking something up. but i'm curious to learn. picked this piece up for what i think was a cheap deal, given the quality of the item (from what i researched). I suppose I could fry the unit by incorrectly hooking something up, but i'm only going be soldering the removable pin out harness, so I wouldn't even be in the innards of the module. i'm also not concerned about what this thing looks like or whether its very portable. its a project for my home setup. now, as far as electrocuting myself? yes - i am concerned.
I don't know the ward beck stuff at all, but I'm guessing there's only about six to eight connections (not including grounding the power receptacle to the chassis, and probably the same with the ground on the ward beck boards?) that you'll need to be worrying about.
First though, you'll need an IEC (power) receptacle too, and a fuse right after the 120V on the hot lead of the IEC receptacle. Here's a Digikey part number for an IEC receptacle that has a built in spot for a fuse: Q201-ND Very useful. I plan to use these for the rest of my projects. I'd get something like a .5 amp fuse.
Anyway,
You'll connect from the hot IEC lead to the on/off throw switch, and connect that to the hot lead of the power transformer, so that the connection is broken when the switch is in the off position. Connect the other primary lead of the power transformer to the neutral of the IEC connector. Connect the IEC connector's ground to the chassis. BTW, try not to have the unit plugged in when working on it, because that first lead from the IEC hot pin to the on/off switch is live, even when the switch is off.
On the other side of the power transformer, you'll have the secondary leads. The transformer you'll likely have to wire in series. Explanation here: http://www.amveco.com/Miniature_Low_Pro ... mers_2.htm
You'll probably get a 2X24V transformer so the secondary side will likely have the outer wires both putting out 24V of AC, while the inner wires are connected to each other and likely grounded to the P.S. board. Or I don't know, I'm going on my recent experience with the Mnats board which wants two leads of 24V AC.
You'll need to figure out where to connect the two 24V AC leads to the power supply, and then on the other side of the power supply, where to take the +25V and -25V DC and connect those to the ward beck modules.
Crap, then there is of course the audio ins and outs.
But anyway, the only way I learned to do any of this stuff is just by breaking everything up into a series of small tasks and researching exactly what that task entailed. I don't know shit yet though.
But when you finish this job, I think you'll realize that it wasn't really THAT hard. The four components theoretically are the ward beck cards, the power transformer, the power supply, and the chassis. The hardest thing for me when building things so far has been trying to figure out connections between the card and the pots/switches, but since you already probably have all the pots and switches wired up, this shouldn't be a problem.
If you post on prodigy pro, they'll probably be able to tell you how many amps you want for a power transformer. They'll probably recommend an Avel, Amveco, or Antec torroid tranny. I'm pretty familier with the Amvecos and I can tell you what wires to connect to each other on the tranny and to the switch/receptacle and the power supply on the secondary side.
First though, you'll need an IEC (power) receptacle too, and a fuse right after the 120V on the hot lead of the IEC receptacle. Here's a Digikey part number for an IEC receptacle that has a built in spot for a fuse: Q201-ND Very useful. I plan to use these for the rest of my projects. I'd get something like a .5 amp fuse.
Anyway,
You'll connect from the hot IEC lead to the on/off throw switch, and connect that to the hot lead of the power transformer, so that the connection is broken when the switch is in the off position. Connect the other primary lead of the power transformer to the neutral of the IEC connector. Connect the IEC connector's ground to the chassis. BTW, try not to have the unit plugged in when working on it, because that first lead from the IEC hot pin to the on/off switch is live, even when the switch is off.
On the other side of the power transformer, you'll have the secondary leads. The transformer you'll likely have to wire in series. Explanation here: http://www.amveco.com/Miniature_Low_Pro ... mers_2.htm
You'll probably get a 2X24V transformer so the secondary side will likely have the outer wires both putting out 24V of AC, while the inner wires are connected to each other and likely grounded to the P.S. board. Or I don't know, I'm going on my recent experience with the Mnats board which wants two leads of 24V AC.
You'll need to figure out where to connect the two 24V AC leads to the power supply, and then on the other side of the power supply, where to take the +25V and -25V DC and connect those to the ward beck modules.
Crap, then there is of course the audio ins and outs.
But anyway, the only way I learned to do any of this stuff is just by breaking everything up into a series of small tasks and researching exactly what that task entailed. I don't know shit yet though.
But when you finish this job, I think you'll realize that it wasn't really THAT hard. The four components theoretically are the ward beck cards, the power transformer, the power supply, and the chassis. The hardest thing for me when building things so far has been trying to figure out connections between the card and the pots/switches, but since you already probably have all the pots and switches wired up, this shouldn't be a problem.
If you post on prodigy pro, they'll probably be able to tell you how many amps you want for a power transformer. They'll probably recommend an Avel, Amveco, or Antec torroid tranny. I'm pretty familier with the Amvecos and I can tell you what wires to connect to each other on the tranny and to the switch/receptacle and the power supply on the secondary side.
Stilgar, we've got wormsign the likes of which God has never seen!
good luck. i went through this when i racked up some 470's and 472's. fwiw, the eq's are awesome, and i like the pre's too(although i generally dont think mic pre sound is a big deal).
IIRC, i had to use 2 power supplies, i think one was to generate +25 and the other to generate -25. i think i had to reference the two to each other, so they wouldnt float. i do remember that i did it wrong once or twice before i did it right. sorry im not more helpful.
EDIT: i do know that i just have 2 PSU's that were straight out the box from power one or digikey or something like that. does that help?
IIRC, i had to use 2 power supplies, i think one was to generate +25 and the other to generate -25. i think i had to reference the two to each other, so they wouldnt float. i do remember that i did it wrong once or twice before i did it right. sorry im not more helpful.
EDIT: i do know that i just have 2 PSU's that were straight out the box from power one or digikey or something like that. does that help?
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kuene
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ok. now my head hurts. 
all the information has been extremely helpful. i've been able to poke around, with al of the input, and discover that this is probably more involved than I had anticipated. I had no idea this involved 2 power supplies, transformers, and seemingly endless new parts that keep cropping up. uh oh, i said to myself.
so now my next question, anybody in the nyc area that wants to rack up a ward beck?
all the information has been extremely helpful. i've been able to poke around, with al of the input, and discover that this is probably more involved than I had anticipated. I had no idea this involved 2 power supplies, transformers, and seemingly endless new parts that keep cropping up. uh oh, i said to myself.so now my next question, anybody in the nyc area that wants to rack up a ward beck?
Hi. I'm replying to this kind of late, and I don't know if what I have to say will be of any value, but...
I'm pretty sure you can use a +/-24 volt supply. You don't need to find one that will do 25 volts. That might make your life easier.
The reason I say this is that every ward beck module I've ever dealt with (six or eight of them) has its own built in regulators that drop the voltages down to more like +/-18 as soon as they get inside. As a result, all you really need is a reasonable amount of headroom over 18 to let the regulators work. Probably 20 volts would work just as well.
I don't think I've ever actually worked on a 470, but I'm pretty sure this is completely general, the WBS did this with all of their modules.
Ned
I'm pretty sure you can use a +/-24 volt supply. You don't need to find one that will do 25 volts. That might make your life easier.
The reason I say this is that every ward beck module I've ever dealt with (six or eight of them) has its own built in regulators that drop the voltages down to more like +/-18 as soon as they get inside. As a result, all you really need is a reasonable amount of headroom over 18 to let the regulators work. Probably 20 volts would work just as well.
I don't think I've ever actually worked on a 470, but I'm pretty sure this is completely general, the WBS did this with all of their modules.
Ned
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kuene
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ok. i think i'm getting a hold of things. all the help is great i've emailed with Raul at fivefish. i think if i get the psu-2448 (which he will adjust to +/-25V) AND the power transformer kit (which include the fuse holder, IEC, and transformer) - i should have what i need to power this up.
Am I mistaken?
I can't thank all of you enough for the kind help.
Am I mistaken?
I can't thank all of you enough for the kind help.
I would suggest that you contact GRS Pro Audio Systems for help on this.
They make power supplies specifically for recording consoles and rack equipment.
They have made many power supplies for me in the past 10 plus years.
They also service all of our studio equipment and do a great job.
Here's some of the powers supplies we have from them:
I bet if you told the guys are GRS they could help you out with a ready made PSU for your console.
Talk to either Ted or Joe at GRS www.grssystems.com
Hope this helps you out !
Maha
Maha's Sound Designs
They make power supplies specifically for recording consoles and rack equipment.
They have made many power supplies for me in the past 10 plus years.
They also service all of our studio equipment and do a great job.
Here's some of the powers supplies we have from them:
I bet if you told the guys are GRS they could help you out with a ready made PSU for your console.
Talk to either Ted or Joe at GRS www.grssystems.com
Hope this helps you out !
Maha
Maha's Sound Designs
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