New jargon - redefining the language of mic placement

[Scodiddly]

Edit: Maybe in relation to a 'zero' point? That is all mics on a given instrument are (x) distant (and (x) ms time wise from a set point instead relatively to the point they're aiming at.

Good point. What is the zero point, timewise? Everything referenced to the center of the top head of the snare, maybe? I can see things getting complicated pretty quick here.

Possibly one way out is to look at how things are typically done now, on a drum-by-drum basis with close mics. We make some assumptions about tom mics, such as that a mic on a particular tom doesn't pick up other sources in any significant way, and that the toms don't get into other mics in a way that significantly compromises those signals. Which, when you really start thinking about it, is a rather difficult position to defend when you look at the signal mixing going on between close mics, overheads, and room mics.


I was also thinking that maybe we should be describing mic placement more like polar coordinates... Instead of defining X, Y, and Z for both source and mic, we define distance between source and mic, relative angles of both, and artificial time offset. Sort of like how people describe putting a mic on a guitar amp - "right against the grille cloth, near the cone edge, and pointed towards the center".

[nordberg]

i did some drums recently with a bottom snare mic (beta 57) right against the head with the kick beater in the null as best i could, a outside kick mic (oktava ml-52) about a foot and a half out a bit to the side and about a foot off the ground facing where the kick met the floor and mono overhead (fat head) 44 inches above the snare looking slightly forward toward the rack tom and a 'room' mic that i actually put outside (yeah really outside) facing the slightly ajar door (open just enough to get the cable out) the drums sounded good without the room mic but i wanted to see if i could use it. i brought this mic forward in time (i don't know the milsecs, just until it felt right) and brought it up just in the louder parts of the song (intro, chorus, guitar solo). in the rest of the song, so that the sound didn't change too dramatically, i put a gate on it and sidechained it to a gated copy (not in the mix) of the bottom snare snare mic. this was probably one of the coolest sounds i've gotten in a long time.

[richierichie]

Take the drum room mic... setting aside whether or not it's possible to simulate one with a close mic and delay, how about applying negative delay to a real room mic? Slide that track back in the DAW 20 milliseconds to bring it up close to the kit. The reverberation won't change, but you'll get rid of any 20 millisecond delays in whatever direct kit sound is reaching that mic.

Yeah, that's been working for me recently. That 20ms delay may be the LAST thing you want on a particular track, but the flavour of the drums (or whatever you are mic-ing) at that place in the room may be just perfect, and often adds a pleasing complexity to the close mic-ed sound. I'm pretty sure a similar technique was used on Spector tracks in the 60s to thicken up the vocals. Obviously, he was using quite an early version of Cubase

Jeez, I'm making bad jokes like my Grandad...

[r0t4ry]

What a silly thing to do. Why would you simulate a room mic instead of just putting it up and recording it and get a 100% better sound from it than emulation. Seriously people, try making things fit while recording instead of fixing it 'after the mix'.

[RoyMatthews]

What a silly thing to do. Why would you simulate a room mic instead of just putting it up and recording it and get a 100% better sound from it than emulation. Seriously people, try making things fit while recording instead of fixing it 'after the mix'.

Well, You may not have the space or a big enough room. I think this is more a creative way of thinking and not a method of fixing.
I've delayed room mics before and it never really worked for me. There's too much of a distinct delay compared to the same distance mic. There's something about the room tone that fills the space between the hits better than the delay.

'course Albini does it all the time and he keeps busy.

[mcsquishytooshy]

Haha... how about... pitch & yaw?

[0-it-hz]

Altitude & azimuth (like an ambisonic mic)

[Wagz]

I'm gonna have to try this next time I do drums, just for the fun of it.
For me, trying new things is like trying a new raw element at the bar, a shot of whiskey by itself, give it a taste and you then decide what it would be good mixed with.

Delaying a close room mic: take five minutes and try a take with it, see what you can do with it, then in the future try and apply the process where you think it might work.

[premiumdan]

Haven't tried this; just brainstorming here:

Set up as many mics as record-at-one-time possible and
place 'em all over the room/overhead. In your software,
zoom in to the waveforms and align only the bass-drum
hits. I figure that everything else will be delayed/phased
all kinds of crazy ways, especially the cymbals. This should
help the kit cut through a mix, but probably not in a good
way. Might sound like it's under water or a bad mp3...

Cheers!

-Dan