mackie preamp -> protools question

[alJones]

hi,
I'm using the first 4 channels of my mackie mixer as preamps into protools. The only level setting device prior to the insert seems to be the trim. Am I correct in thinking there is no other way to set the output level? It's unlikely the proper trim level for the preamp will be the proper signal level for protools.

thanks,
al

[ott0bot]

I'm thinking that using the insert you can only use the trim to adjust the volume. No if you pull the 1/4" jack out so that it only engages the tip it should send at full volume....because it's meant to accept a trs the tip being the send and the ring being the return....i'm pretty sure at least.

If your mixer has direct outs you can send it post fader. You could also send it to a the bus channels if it has that then direct out. You could also use the aux sends as well...but thats usually pre-fader too.

Are you using the mackie for the 4 non-pre'd analog inputs on a 002 or 003 by chance?

recent post with similar question:
http://messageboard.tapeop.com/viewtopic.php?t=61543

[JGriffin]

The inserts on the mackie are post-trim, pre-fader. Why are you not using the main outs? Depending on which mackie you have, the mute button re-routes the signal to bus 3/4, giving you 4 outs from the board and enabling you to use your faders.

Alternately, use the auxes, you get to use the trim pot and then use the aux knob as a 'fader.'

[Nick Sevilla]

hi,
I'm using the first 4 channels of my mackie mixer as preamps into protools. The only level setting device prior to the insert seems to be the trim. Am I correct in thinking there is no other way to set the output level? It's unlikely the proper trim level for the preamp will be the proper signal level for protools.

thanks,
al

Which Mackie mixer?

Some have Direct outputs, some have an ALT 3 / 4 output, while even others have Busses.

SO, which one are you using?

[alJones]

thanks for your comments
I am running a firewire 1814 into protools. It is a mackie 1202 vlz pro - with the alt 3/4 output.

I understand (more or less) how I could use the main output as some have suggested - I have done this in the past with a single track. I imagnine the alt 3/4 would be the same way. But can I get my 4 discrete channels into the 1814 this way? It seems there are only 2 outputs in each case - I don't want to do the mixing in the mackie, I want to do that in protools.

My understanding of the busses if weak, but can someone shed light on this? Anyway, if I've misstated it, my question is how I can get 4 independant outputs from the mackie into my 1814.

thanks for your help.
al

[vorian]

Unless I'm missing something it seems like you're thinking about this a little too hard. Why wouldn't taking signal from the inserts give you want protools needs? Have you hooked it up and tried it? Unless you've done that and it sounds bad or you can't get decent levels, what's wrong?

[JGriffin]

thanks for your comments
I am running a firewire 1814 into protools. It is a mackie 1202 vlz pro - with the alt 3/4 output.

I understand (more or less) how I could use the main output as some have suggested - I have done this in the past with a single track. I imagnine the alt 3/4 would be the same way. But can I get my 4 discrete channels into the 1814 this way? It seems there are only 2 outputs in each case - I don't want to do the mixing in the mackie, I want to do that in protools.

My understanding of the busses if weak, but can someone shed light on this? Anyway, if I've misstated it, my question is how I can get 4 independant outputs from the mackie into my 1814.

thanks for your help.
al

Think of the main stereo outs of the Mackie as "Bus 1/2." Using the pan knobs, you can assign a signal to either bus 1 or 2. Pan a channel all the way left, it's going to bus 1; all the way right, it's bus 2. Now, if you hit the Mute button, it re-routes the signal to Alt bus 3/4 and the situation is the same: Left is bus 3, right is bus 4.

So for example:

Wire the Mackie into the 1814 as follows:

Mackie Main Out L ->1814 Channel 1
Mackie Main Out R ->1814 Channel 2
Mackie Alt Out L/3 ->1814 Channel 3
Mackie Alt Out R/4 ->1814 Channel 4

Now, say you're going to record 2 guitars and 2 vocals. Set it up like this:

--Guitar mic 1 into Mackie channel 1, Pan left, signal goes to 1814 channel 1.

--Guitar mic 2 into Mackie channel 2, Pan right, signal goes to 1814 channel 2.

--Vocal mic 1 into Mackie channel 3, engage Mute button, Pan left, signal goes out Mackie alt 3 to 1814 channel 3.

--Vocal mic 2 into Mackie channel 4, engage Mute button, Pan right, signal goes out mackie alt 4 to 1814 channel 4.

All discrete, all levels controllable with the channel faders on the Mackie. Bob's yer uncle.

[alJones]

that's awesome. I'm a little dense in that I needed a real world example. I'm totally ready to go now. Thanks for taking the time. I won't need to ask this sort of question again.

Al

[JGriffin]

Glad to help.

[Zygomorph]

To go back to the original post:

Why would the proper level for the preamp be different for the proper level for the PT input? Generally, the proper level for the preamp is what gets you the the proper level at your recording device's input. (Unless you're "pushing" a pre for color or whatever, but I can't imagine an easily defensible reason for doing this with a Mackie...)

If I remember correctly, the operating manual for those Mackie mixers actually teaches you how to use the PFL button to set the trimpots so that the bulk of your source signal stays around the region of 0 dbVU... at which point, the mixer output (faders at unity) should show up at your converters wherever they're calibrated (-18 dbFS for example).

Everything else that the others said still holds, though.

[Zygomorph]

http://www.mackie.com/home/showimage.ht ... 2-VLZ3.jpg

Yeah, there's even a silkscreen, "Level Set" pointing at the 0db = 0dbU mark on the meter, which is further reinforced by a flashing red light when you depress any of the pre-fade SOLO buttons.

Sometimes I like how pedagogical Mackie's products are!

[dsw]

There's another way that you might want to look into at some point: Hosa makes a thing called the DOC-106 which turns inserts into direct outs. That way all four mic channels can be routed out to your 1814, and the mixer still functions like normal.

They are list price $15 each and they are just a TRS plug and a female 1/4" jack on about 6" of cable.

Granted Hosa is not a real high quality company, but I bet these would work just fine for a home set-up.