Nice roomy vocals without the nice room

[Gaz]

I've always wanted those roomy 10-feet from the mic vocal sounds, especially for shouted vocals, but I've never had the right room. I want it to sound like the vocals and drums are in the same acoustic setting, but using the same room mic in combination with a close mic for vocals never sounds right - it seems like the drums can work with a not so perfect space more than vocals can, and the vocals just bring out the worst in the room. I'd still like to use a close mic to smash, but need some distance so it doesn't sound like someone's yelling into listener's ear, and mixing the vocals low just isn't working for me.

Is it out of the question to put two mics next to each other (electrical tape two SM57s together, for example), and apply a 'nice' room reverb on one of them? How would the 3 to 1 rule apply here?

I'd like to know this to use on guitars as well - give them 'room'... in a basement.

thanks for any responses to my first post.

[vvv]

It's not "out of the question"; see here.

I would just forget about any "rules", and try it.

[chris harris]

Is it out of the question to put two mics next to each other (electrical tape two SM57s together, for example), and apply a 'nice' room reverb on one of them?

It can't hurt to try! Go for it!

How would the 3 to 1 rule apply here?

It wouldn't.

[vorian]

Is it out of the question to put two mics next to each other (electrical tape two SM57s together, for example), and apply a 'nice' room reverb on one of them? How would the 3 to 1 rule apply here?

This might be slightly OT but I saw Jack White do a similar thing live once, with the mics spread just a bit apart. Depending on which way he turned his head his voice what very in your face or miles away.

Have you tried just recording one track and throwing a verb on that?

[joninc]

use a Room sound reverb? impulse verb?

[J.B.Horns]

I'll roll off some of the high end and use a good sounding reverb to push the vocals back.

[mscottweber]

If you are using a DAW, why don't you try recording one vocal track, sending it out to an aux track, and putting reverb on just that aux track? That way you can blend the dry vocal with the reverberated one.

[losthighway]

That, and most reverb units, and plugs, have a mix: dry/wet.

Some things that have made canned reverb less lame for me:

1. Experiment with the parameters (I know duh) especially if you can adjust the pre-delay. Different tempos and moods seem to suit pushing the pre-delay out a little bit so the reverb blooms a bit after the line is spoken. It can add a nice classiness to it.

2. If canned reverb sounds too canned, but you don't have a gymnasium for a kitchen, apply a generous amount of a reverb you like, play the reverb-ed signal through a speaker in your live room with an omni condenser mic set several feet away. The approximated, digitized room sound hits a real room. All those real angles and surfaces end a sudden air of credibility to the fake reverb. That's a favorite hybrid of mine. As always with reamp/remic tricks you usually have to fiddle around to get the delay from the extra send to go away so there aren't nasty phase problems. When it's all set you have your original dry track and your new digital/real world reverb track to mix to taste.

[cjmnash]

easier than putting up two mics is to mult the signal and hit two tracks.

for roomy sounds, you could FTP me the vox and i'll re-amp it (through a studio monitor) out in one of my big open rooms, stereo mic it and send them back to you to blend to taste. (my studio is located in a 33,000 sq foot ex-record pressing plant with great big boomy warehouse spaces)

i also have a great sounding vox chamber- you can hear an example of it (on the intro guitar) here: www.welcometo1979.com . listen to "dink dunk". analog tape pre delay + chamber.

might be what you're looking for- just a thought.

chris

[Gaz]

Thanks for all the brilliant replies.

[drumsound]

2. If canned reverb sounds too canned, but you don't have a gymnasium for a kitchen, apply a generous amount of a reverb you like, play the reverb-ed signal through a speaker in your live room with an omni condenser mic set several feet away. The approximated, digitized room sound hits a real room. All those real angles and surfaces end a sudden air of credibility to the fake reverb. That's a favorite hybrid of mine. As always with reamp/remic tricks you usually have to fiddle around to get the delay from the extra send to go away so there aren't nasty phase problems. When it's all set you have your original dry track and your new digital/real world reverb track to mix to taste.

Reamping a fake room into a real room. That's so crazy it just might work!!!

[losthighway]

I always figured reverb was about math. Math I might not exactly understand, complex fractal patterns of reflections off of multiple surfaces in a three dimensional space. In theory if phony reverb sounds fake to the ear, it could be due to some poor mathematical attempt at recreating the complex interaction of sound with surfaces and a confined space. So if you take that formula that is lacking the complexities of real world information and bounce it off the real world- suddenly it sounds more complex.

I am too poor a scientist to stand behind that with any confidence, but it is where my intuition brought me, and it has good results.

[hobbycore]

2. If canned reverb sounds too canned, but you don't have a gymnasium for a kitchen, apply a generous amount of a reverb you like, play the reverb-ed signal through a speaker in your live room with an omni condenser mic set several feet away. The approximated, digitized room sound hits a real room. All those real angles and surfaces end a sudden air of credibility to the fake reverb. That's a favorite hybrid of mine. As always with reamp/remic tricks you usually have to fiddle around to get the delay from the extra send to go away so there aren't nasty phase problems. When it's all set you have your original dry track and your new digital/real world reverb track to mix to taste.

Best idea ever in the history of man.

[CraigS63]

What was that site you used to be able to upload a sound to, and they would play it back through a gigantic grain bin, "Silo phone" or something? I think that was back in dialup speed Intarweb days though. I wonder if that would be a good business model for studios with good sounding rooms, and lots of down time (recording playbacks of sounds sent in).

[nopenopenope]

you could try setting up a vocal mic as you would normally, but slowly back off it until the proximity effect has fully diminished. Depending on the mic, this could be 1/2 a foot or even 3 feet or more. At this distance, hopefully, you won't have much room sound going on. Do you have any baffles/gobos? This can help keep the room out even more.

Once you have vocals tracked sans proximity effect, maybe roll off a little high end and then send them to reverb of your choice - a room sound and mix it very wet. That should do you just right. I've done this before and it worked pretty well! best of luck.