Internship Offer... Cutting the Grass?!?!?!?!

Stevil · Post by **Stevil** » Thu Jul 30, 2009 9:40 am

jmiller wrote: But if you want exposure to, say, film mixing, or pop (whether you think it's cool or not) buying an mbox and a 57 isn't going to get you there.
It's a nice philosophy, but it is somewhat narrow minded.

my interests in sound are personal & not so much commercial. so for me, i'd get more out of recording what i want in my garage with a 57 for free for the rest of my life, than cleaning toilets in hopes that one day i'll get to record in the pro room a bunch of bands who's music i have no invested interest in. while i'd love the opportunity to pick some high end brains & get my hands on the big toys, it's just not worth it to me personally to go down that road. but i do realize that if that's what you want, there is a path.

Rolsen · Post by **Rolsen** » Thu Jul 30, 2009 10:14 am

If your internship involves not learning anything, but instead cutting grass for no money, might as well work for a landscaper and get $12 an hour for cutting grass. Pardon me, but I don't know where studio guys get off with that sort of attitude. Virtually no other industry is that belittling to interns. Mine isn't, and, post college, I've heard few tales of internships that bad. What gives?

AstroDan · Post by **AstroDan** » Thu Jul 30, 2009 11:25 am

Cutting the grass sounds like something you'd be doing for Old Man Hambone at his salvage yard here in the Ozarks and getting paid in soup.

It just sounds like a real outdated, 70's notion when working for a studio was real exotic, big English castles and doing coke with Slade and everything was unregulated and farm kids were willing to do anything. Like 18th century sailor shit; "aye, I'll wrestle a giant octopus - just don't send me back to Ireland."

I guess it's just sounds more bizarre to me. Recording is out of the pioneer days and too regulated and kids are more educated. If you were in the army or a fireman, I could see it but not for some 'dude' who once did live sound for some classic rock band and now has a yard at his studio.

Neil Weir · Post by **Neil Weir** » Thu Jul 30, 2009 11:30 am

As ridiculous as some of this stuff is, learning how to create a clean and comfortable environment for the bands you're working with is arguably as important as your technical / creative skills...

Plus, you wouldn't believe the number of freaks you have to wade through when you're hiring an intern at a well-known studio before you can find someone that you might be able to trust...

Stevil · Post by **Stevil** » Thu Jul 30, 2009 11:46 am

AstroDan wrote: "aye, I'll wrestle a giant octopus - just don't send me back to Ireland."

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:20 pm

AstroDan wrote:Cutting the grass sounds like something you'd be doing for Old Man Hambone at his salvage yard here in the Ozarks and getting paid in soup.

It just sounds like a real outdated, 70's notion when working for a studio was real exotic, big English castles and doing coke with Slade and everything was unregulated and farm kids were willing to do anything. Like 18th century sailor shit; "aye, I'll wrestle a giant octopus - just don't send me back to Ireland."

If you were in the army or a fireman, I could see it but not for some 'dude' who once did live sound for some classic rock band and now has a yard at his studio.

Ok, make it Scotland, Jack Bruce, the 80's/90's, and hash and the I say , Hey! Stop pickin on me! Hahahahah!
I pay in soup, gotta use that, had some volunteers recently.

Brett Siler · Post by **Brett Siler** » Fri Jul 31, 2009 2:31 pm

Get a job on the side, don't take shit from people, save money and buy gear, go to shows (or even better get a job at a venue) and tell bands you will record them cheaply a quickly, and keep doing that until you have cool gear and technique and can support yourself doing it, or until you burn out and wanna do something else. Don't mow the guys grass, don't text him, don't go to the interview. Just do it yourself. Almost guarantee that dude will put you through some bullshit and will never hire you. Interning at a studio is a scam.

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Fri Jul 31, 2009 2:42 pm

Not if you get hired. I went through crap in mine, cleaned toilet, first thing outta the door, next was organize the tape library, in the hot ass attic, couldn't get on the board till 1 am or later, so, that's when I did it, made mixes till 3-5 am, turned em over to boss, got hired. "Why", I asked at the age of twenty. "because out of the twenty five interns we have, you have ears and aren't an ass or an asshole".
Sounded good to me, that meant it was time to build a rep among the stars, which I did. If they saw my face, they were at ease.
Why?
Because I wouldn't hit on or accept advances by their hot ass chics or bandmembers, wouldn't say weird shit, spit soup, or, try to be best friends or brown nose them. I was there to keep focus and make whatever needed to happen happen and to make it so that magic had an open space to fill up. NOTHING else. overtime, you can make friends, on a tour you will make friends. I was there to make what was called for show up.
Made friends anyway, but, I never put together that "photo album" so many carry around.

Stevil · Post by **Stevil** » Fri Jul 31, 2009 3:19 pm

Brian wrote:"because out of the twenty five interns we have, you have ears and aren't an ass or an asshole".

i think the key here is knowing when you're in a situation where you are being tested for validity as a candidate willing to "pay their dues" vs. being tormented & abused by an egomaniac. this is probably going to vary based on where you personally draw the line, what you're trying to accomplish, how much competition you are immediately up against for a real "slot", luck of the draw, ect...

christopher dwyer · Post by **christopher dwyer** » Fri Jul 31, 2009 6:00 pm

So....
I attempted to go to my interview today. The address they gave me was incorrect or my Iphone was messed up.
Since they didn't want me to call I had to text them telling them I was lost and I ended up being late. The guy called me up finally.... and was screaming at me and used some cursed words. I tried to explain I am new to the area and am not familiar with the area but he wasn't having it. Plus this LA traffic I am still getting used to.
It ended with him saying if you can't find this studio how can you work here, and pretty much hung up on me.
I finally found the house it was very small with very little Grass!!!!
Honestly he was being a complete ass. And totally uncalled for. I admit it was partly my fault, I should of went the day before and looked for the house...

I also asked for information on the studio before hand through emails he wouldn't return any of my emails regarding that.

I think its a bunch of bull proving yourself to work for a studio like that.
"You have to cut my grass to prove yourself you want to work here"
How about you prove to me your serious about hiring me and come over to my apartment and do the dishes?
I just don't understand if your studio is so busy that you need an intern... why don't you pay them at least minimum wage? I don't get it....
I don't mind getting my hands dirty... cleaning bathrooms making coffee, remodeling the studio, painting ( i actually like that) but I think this guy just wanted to abuse some interns look what I experienced on the phone with him for just 3 minutes.
I'm done ranting sorry if this offends anyone.

CurtZHP · Post by **CurtZHP** » Fri Jul 31, 2009 8:24 pm

Sounds like you just earned 1 more course credit from the "School of Hard Knocks."

Spark · Post by **Spark** » Sat Aug 01, 2009 4:35 pm

christopher dwyer wrote: I just don't understand if your studio is so busy that you need an intern... why don't you pay them at least minimum wage? I don't get it....

I have no problem with the starting at the bottom and doing the shitty work (including the cleaning of toilets or cutting the grass, someone has to do it), but this part of the equation always seemed a little criminal to me.

Post by **TapeOpLarry** » Sat Aug 01, 2009 5:41 pm

I used to take interns, mostly from CRAS in AZ. They needed to intern for some amount of hours before getting their diploma or certificate. I ran/run a tiny studio that at that point could have not afforded to pay anyone or even pay the taxes and ins involved. I made the interns weed the front steps and keep it looking good out there. Am I a bad person?

CurtZHP · Post by **CurtZHP** » Sat Aug 01, 2009 7:44 pm

TapeOpLarry wrote: Am I a bad person?

Horrible, bad, nasty, evil, demonic, unsanitary!

Then again, if they owned their own studio, they'd be pulling weeds there too.

signorMars · Post by **signorMars** » Sat Aug 01, 2009 8:05 pm

i think part of why you have an intern (in ANY field) is to have someone to do the little stuff (buying coffee, mowing grass, cleaning patchbay cable plugs, etc) so that you can get your work done. in exchange, the intern is allowed to observe industry pros and how they do their jobs. in recording this includes of course the mic techniques, effects, etc, but also client relations, billing, maintenance and such. interns are paid commensurate to the supply and demand of the intern labor market. there are 13,656 members of this board. sure, there are a good number of established professionals on this board, but there are certainly a lot of intern level folks and everything in between. plus hundreds graduating from recording schools everyday... so, basically... if you won't intern for free, someone else will. so that sets the market wage at zero. sucks. you won't work for free? someone else will.

plus, from the limited exposure to other people's studios books that i have had, booked solid does not equal exceptionally profitable. the same market force that keeps intern pay at zero, exceptionally large amounts of competition et al, keeps studio rates low enough that giant profits just aren't happening, so probably, paying an intern MIGHT put a studio under. it certainly cuts into funds that can be used for gear, maintenance, etc... plus taxes and the legal side of a business get more complicated/expensive as soon as you have employees.

ask any friends you have in the film industry what it's like trying to break into THAT industry. recording industry is cake compared to that crap. if you don't want to work for free... don't. read tapeop, read mix, read the forums. you can learn a lot that way. if you want to get first hand experience assisting an established engineer at an established studio and maybe even get a foot in the door in the industry... be an intern. work for free and work hard. then start booking your own sessions and making money. try to barter for studio time on off days or late nights when there isn't something set up in the studio. record bands at cut rates during this time... build up your discography. stay out of the way, do whatever the engineer tells you to do... even if it's shutting the hell up and doing nothing.

so long story short... internships can be tough, but extremely worth it...

Message Board

Internship Offer... Cutting the Grass?!?!?!?!

Who is online