Recording a bluegrass band, need help.

[tonewoods]

Bluegrass is traditionally recorded live with a single stereo mic. Or at least I like to think it is.

It's always amazed me--after chatting up the "big boys" in the bluegrass recording world--how few recordings are actually done this way....

I've always wanted to record a bluegrass band with 2 stacked RCA BK11's and a mic (RCA 44BX?) on the bass....
Someday.....

[MoreSpaceEcho]

It's always amazed me--after chatting up the "big boys" in the bluegrass recording world--how few recordings are actually done this way...

well, c'mon now, you think you can just leave us hanging like that? spill it.

[Nick Sevilla]

not to hijack this, but a friend played me The Crow last night. I was really impressed by how gorgeous the sound was. Nice job Noeqplease!

Thank you. This was done contrary to the OP's question about less mics set up.

All of the tracks were close spot mics, one on each instrument, except for Steve Martin's banjo, which I requested they use 4 mic at all times. Why 4 mics? Why not? Since there were going to be different studios, I had to have more choices for mixdown.

I Usually requested a U87 or U67, and a Neumann KM84 or similar, plus two "mystery mics" that the producer would choose for each song on the spot, to keep it interesting. Sometimes we used only one mic, sometimes all 4 in a blend.

This helped in keeping Steve's sound fresh throughout the album.

In this particular album I did NOT use the room mics. I don't know where they were placed, but they were pretty much unusable due to the phase issues in the high and low end of the spectrum. I made up by using Capitol Studios' chambers to re-record ambience, and also some nice Convoluted Reverbs Thanks to Waves IR1, and Logic's Space Designer. Plus some short delays.

Cheers

[erroneous]

Very cool, thanks for the info.
I like the 'mystery mic' approach. Always an extra texture available.

[tonewoods]

It's always amazed me--after chatting up the "big boys" in the bluegrass recording world--how few recordings are actually done this way...

well, c'mon now, you think you can just leave us hanging like that? spill it.

Well, let's just say that there's a lot of click track usage, iso-ed rooms, headphones galore, overdubs forever, and lots of techniques that one doesn't normally associate with bluegrass recording...

And I guess a lot of it sounds like it was recorded that way....

Want to hear some steller modern recordings of a killer bluegrass band using one or two mics??

Get ahold of just about any Del McCoury live recording--most are bootlegs...

The way they work the 2 mics--both on solos and backup--is just incredible, and would work well as a studio technique, too...

Here's an example...

Just two mics, no mic on the bass, and audience mics.....
Mix to taste....

[AlexHerd]

Want to hear some steller modern recordings of a killer bluegrass band using one or two mics??

Get ahold of just about any Del McCoury live recording--most are bootlegs...

The way they work the 2 mics--both on solos and backup--is just incredible, and would work well as a studio technique, too...

Here's an example...

Just two mics, no mic on the bass, and audience mics.....
Mix to taste....

I love Del, they are masters of the two mic setup. Hundreds of free legal Dels shows here: http://www.archive.org/details/DelMcCouryBand

[MoreSpaceEcho]

Here's an example...

WOW. that sounds amazing even on my laptop.

i dunno how people can play the mandolin. i have one here and even with my stubby little fingers i still feel like a caveman trying to play that thing.

[Aquaman]

For the band grouped around the stereo mic approach, listen a bit in the control room (or on phones) while the band warms up. You can balance the sound by asking musicians to take a half- or a quarter-step forward or back until the mix sounds good.

Once the balance is solid, use a piece of tape on the ground to mark each player's leading foot position so if they break for a bit they can all get back at exactly the right distance from the mic again.

It's fun to wow musicians who have never recorded like this before. They literally can't believe how good a well-balanced stereo recording can be. Now you kids get off of my lawn.

[willhouk]

I am pretty new to bluegrass so this has been quite the lesson for me. The Del McCoury Band is amazing, those guys are great musicians. I am definitely going to make it to the High Sierra Music Festival in Quincy this summer. I am listening to their performance from 2009 right now. Thanks for all the links.

[accordion squeezist]

for future projects... you may be thinking your Echo Gina is limited to 2-trk recording, however, if I understand it correctly, you have 2 more inputs available through S/PDIF. All you is a 2-ch mic pre with that type of digital out. Then you can record 4 tracks simultaneously (2 analog+2 digital)
I use an Echo card in that manner.

[Sean Sullivan]

We record Del and the Boys all the time at our studio. We did his last album, Family Circle, and his new box set. Someone in that band is at the studio at least once a week, working on some project or another. On Tuesday we are recording them with The Lee Boys, and it will be about 10 people in the studio!

When we are working with them, Del has a his own U47 he bought from Blackbird that he brings to the studio with him for his vocals. His guitar usually has a C451 or KM84. Ronnie's mandolin is usually a KM84, so is Jason Carter's fiddle. Rob's banjo either has a U87 or, believe it or not, a CAD M177. Most of the time Alan's bass fiddle is just the mic on his bridge, which is a Countryman I believe. Everything is recorded with UA or Presonus MP-20 preamps. Everyone is in the same room, with baffles, except for Del who's in the booth. He belts it when he sing, so he'd get picked up in everyone's microphone.

No click tracks with them, everything is recorded live. There is the occasional punch, if someone wants to clean up a break

I like to do things a little differently with banjo. I like a U87 and a KM84 together. KM84 at the heel of the banjo, and a U87 for the tone ring. I did this when I had Bela Fleck in the studio for a Daytrotter session and he really liked the sound. He usually uses a U89 and KM184 in a similar set up.

When the McCoury's play live, they have five microphones set up. 3 Audio Technica's (4040 or 4033, I can't remember) and 2 Neumann BCM-104's. The Audio Technica's are waist height and pick up the instruments, 1 BCM-104 and the for the fiddle when he takes a break, and 1 BCM-104 that they all sing into. Alan's bass is run directly to the board, he has a mic on his bridge.

Honestly, you could record those guys with anything and it be great, I'm constantly amazed by their musicianship. Ronnie is the best mandolin player I've ever heard, and Del has such a unique voice. His finger's fly on that guitar. Sometimes, after long sessions, his index finger will lock up in this crooked position, in a Z shape. Bouncing around that finger board for 50 years will do that to your hands!

[dgrieser]

Sean,

Thanks for sharing that info. The level of experience of the people who post here is what makes TOMB so great. How does Del record? Just ask on TOMB. Wow.

I've never seen a show where Del & the Boys didn't give it all they've got. You've got to really play your instruments to project through those mics live. It's not like having a pickup and just picking really lightly and letting the pickup do all the work. They seem like really nice folks too from my interaction with them at workshops and after shows.

[tonewoods]

Honestly, you could record those guys with anything and it be great...

Ya know, a great concept for a Del album would be to set up a single RCA 44BX, and maybe a mic on the bass, and go for it...

Stick Ronnie on the null...

It would great to hear an old school production like that, with such a great band at the helm....

Call it "44BX", and make it well-known how the record was recorded....

I'd buy one...

[Sean Sullivan]

That would be fun, to go down to a place like Sun Studios and make a record that way.

Send me a check for the cost and I'll see what I can do

[Sean Sullivan]

Tomorrow is going to be a challenge, we're recording the McCoury's live with the Lee Boys, a sacred steel band. Nine people at once! Electric guitar, drum kit, steel, electric bass, upright bass, banjo, mandolin, fiddle and vocals.