which ITB system best for beginners?

[snoopy23]

Okay, I am finally getting over my resistance to moving "ITB" and I am wondering of the collective vast experience on this MB can point me in the right direction. Although Pro Tools may be the best known software, what in your opinion is the easiest/best software for a novice? I have had many years working on a real board with my trusty adats, but I am recognizing the need to move more into the new century and I am looking for the least expensive/easiest to learn combination. What say you, people?

[Gentleman Jim]

For starters, just get some janky Y-cable to hook the outs of your board to the line in of your computer. That's the cheapest way to experiment for now. The reason I would advise against getting an interface right away is in case you decide to go with a version of Pro Tools you'll need to get the hardware from them.

You can get free demo downloads of Cubase 4, Mackie Tracktion 2, Presonus Studio One, and Cockos Reaper. So there you have four choices to check out that don't require spending more than the price of that Y-cable. Not too shabby.

If you're on a Mac, you already have GarageBand. Check that out as well.

If you have friends who use DAW's, hit 'em all up. Spend a couple of hours with each of them showing you how their software of choice works.

And of course, there's always the dreaded trip to Guitar Center and/or the Apple Store. Just make sure you take your Valium before you go, and remember: while you can walk out whenever you become overwhelmed by the fumes of stupidity in either of those places, the annoyingly clueless "Associates"/"Geniuses" are stuck there until at least the end of the current pay period.

Welcome to the sexy, exciting world of software!

[ott0bot]

I actually found Pro Tools to be the easiest to learn coming from a backround of doing ADAT and cassette recording and live sound work. If you want to work in a studio you'll most likely have to learn Pro Tools. Also, like Jim said you have to use their interface when using protools. If you're just doing music creation for yourself Logic is really nice, and you can use any interface you choose.

I'd suggest the following if you don't care about working in a studio:

If on a PC
Cheapest: Reaper

If on a MAC
Easiest: Garage Band then upgrade to Logic when you want more features.

[mrc]

Intel i7 or AMD 955/965 Phenom Black system
Antec case
Pair of Large fast (7200 rpm) Sata drives
4 to 8 gig fast ram (depending on OS)
Antec or quieter Powersupply 750 or more watts
Quiet Video card with HDMI and 512 or more memory
32" or larger HDMI 1080p monitor
Uad 2 Duo or Quad and plugin packages
RME fireface 800 (would let you interface your adats)
Nuendo, Sonar 8.5, Cubase, Reaper...your choice
Wavelab or SoundForge


That should get you close I moved from Tape to Adats to ITB at the start of Cubase as a daw, and after many years and systems, and this is very close to where I'm at. I differ by a 26" vizio monitor (too small), Rme 9652 Hammerfall (uses a slot and very old) 2xUAD 1 pcie (use too many slots) and a TC powercore pci. Also run a Line 6 KB37 with all of the effects packages. I'm still running XP due to driver problems with Win7, though I lust for more ram than 4 gig.

YMMV
mrc
ps, I loved Austin in the early 80's, how is it now?

[tubetapexfmr]

Mac mini plus Harrison Mixbus
http://store.apple.com/us/browse/home/s ... TAyNTQzNTk
http://www.harrisonconsoles.com/joomla/ ... &Itemid=42

Add monitor, keyboard, mouse, external record drive, and sound card. Now you have a world class console ITB.

[mrc]

tubetapexfmr,
Thanks for the heads up, the software and price looks great. I'm sure the board emulation is superb, however, there isn't much info to be had at their site...sort of a pig-in-a-poke at this point. It's true I've pissed more out in a bar than that in a nite, but buying a mac is a bit much, and the effects support doesn't sound too promising. No mention of vst, dx, rtas, and a lot of doubt about AU effects, as well.
No mater what system you buy, you are still going to need a decent I/O system to fit your channel and equipment needs. If you have customers you've worked with on other formats, they may want to come back and work on those formats, as well as new customers...so it's not as simple for existing studios as it might seem. I still have equipment to sync up several different tape systems to my daw, as well as the machines, from a 4 track tascam 8 channel mixer/midi machine, on up to adats. Just buying an audio card can be complex. When I buy a new mother board I need to think about how to make all the old gear work with it, and what it may cost to make that work. Even owning a lot of outboard gear can provide gotcha's for daw interface buyers.
Mac lovers love Macs, and the image of PT as the only system has hung on as the investors are heavily invested and loudspoken because their money is talking to them. The Studio biz is WAY down from where it was a few decades ago, a lot of studios got caught in the gear wars of yesteryear, boards, outboardgear, and 24 track decks. The question is do you want debt, and have a rep to pay it off? An M powered PT system on the side, will give you "compatibility" for way less, and you can always convert files to whatever format you need. Unless you are running a bunch of traveling engineers, who cares if anyone else likes your daw, and how long will that (traveling engineers) survive, anyway.

[east3rdst]

Pro Tools hands down is the easiest to transition from an out of the box situation. Its very intuitive and laid out like a real mixer. People will argue for Logic and Nuendo, and maybe if you're using your daw as an instrument (lots of midi, synthy tweak head stuff), they'd have a point, but for straight up recording Pro Tools is the way to go. Plus with PT 8 the editing and midi and free instruments has been really stepped up.

Also stick with a Apple, don't waste you time with Microsoft. You won't have to stress yourself with some custom computer with many different manufacturers parts in side that may or may not by compatible/exist down the road.

[east3rdst]

also, Apple gets updated before Windows every time. Also also, you get to use Time Machine, which is awesome. And as mentioned, grab yourself a good fast second hard drive and a couple external hard drives for back up.

[kingtoad]

Pro Tools hands down is the easiest to transition from an out of the box situation. Its very intuitive and laid out like a real mixer. People will argue for Logic and Nuendo, and maybe if you're using your daw as an instrument (lots of midi, synthy tweak head stuff), they'd have a point, but for straight up recording Pro Tools is the way to go. Plus with PT 8 the editing and midi and free instruments has been really stepped up.

Also stick with a Apple, don't waste you time with Microsoft. You won't have to stress yourself with some custom computer with many different manufacturers parts in side that may or may not by compatible/exist down the road.

I'm not saying PT should not be an option, but I don't think it's anywhere near as black and white as you make out. PT LE is massively handicapped in comparison to every other "pro" DAW out there - no automatic delay compensation, pretty low default track limit (I think, could be wrong about this), far fewer free plugins, etc.

Yes, Pro Tools definitely has its advantages, but unless you are willing to fork out for an HD system it has some pretty clear disadvantages too.

[east3rdst]

Pro Tools hands down is the easiest to transition from an out of the box situation. Its very intuitive and laid out like a real mixer. People will argue for Logic and Nuendo, and maybe if you're using your daw as an instrument (lots of midi, synthy tweak head stuff), they'd have a point, but for straight up recording Pro Tools is the way to go. Plus with PT 8 the editing and midi and free instruments has been really stepped up.

Also stick with a Apple, don't waste you time with Microsoft. You won't have to stress yourself with some custom computer with many different manufacturers parts in side that may or may not by compatible/exist down the road.

I'm not saying PT should not be an option, but I don't think it's anywhere near as black and white as you make out. PT LE is massively handicapped in comparison to every other "pro" DAW out there - no automatic delay compensation, pretty low default track limit (I think, could be wrong about this), far fewer free plugins, etc.

Yes, Pro Tools definitely has its advantages, but unless you are willing to fork out for an HD system it has some pretty clear disadvantages too.

PT has no Auto Delay Comp, but that isn't as big a deal as people make it out to be, It has 48 stereo tracks and PT 8 comes with a whack of plugins to start, plus you can always run the pluggo stuff. True, not as much as the VST stuff, but those can get pretty redundant.

I think considering the original post, PT is the best route, unless you're on a shoe string budget. Even then you could jump into a used set up for a lot less.

I remember moving from Cubase on a Windows system, to PT on a Mac. I was impressed with how much smoother everything run. Not just the Mac, but the workflow inside PT.

[CedarSound]

I am looking for the least expensive/easiest to learn combination.

Based on this question, I'll say...

PC - cheaper than a Mac (yes, you may have to learn how to optimize the system. Oh, and Macs crash sometimes too.. there, I said it.) *puts on flame suit*

Reaper - $60 bucks... easy to learn, very flexible, built in Delay compensation, customizable skins, low profile, stable.

Echo interface - good drivers, good sound, especially for the money.


Now, if it's not about least expensive/easiest to learn, then that's a whole other conversation.


My two cents.

[Nick Sevilla]

Pro Tools LE.

[kinger]

I used to use Reaper but I've since switched to Record; I'm really liking the workflow and the sound and I'm recording a lot more actual music now that I'm no longer spending hours looking for that next great plugin. It's not the cheapest out there though, but I'm certainly digging it. If you're coming from the OTB world, you may find it very intuitive. YMMV.

[Dakota]

Okay, I am finally getting over my resistance to moving "ITB" and I am wondering of the collective vast experience on this MB can point me in the right direction. Although Pro Tools may be the best known software, what in your opinion is the easiest/best software for a novice? I have had many years working on a real board with my trusty adats, but I am recognizing the need to move more into the new century and I am looking for the least expensive/easiest to learn combination. What say you, people?

Would you be doing music mostly for yourself, or also for others and paying clients sometimes? That has some influence on your decision.

If for yourself, any DAW you can get comfortable with. Reaper is great for cheap. If also for paying work, PTLE hands down, even though it's deliberately slightly crippled to try to get you to go PTHD some day. It's the most universal session format for paid work. Editing and tracking is very good in PT, any version. Logic is also much in play for paid work.

Also, how much do you want to get into virtual instruments, software synths, midi piano rolls, loops and crazy audio manipulation? Some DAWS are way better than others for that. The Cubase/Nuendo family. Ableton Live. FL Studio I find very fast, fun, and productive for manipulated audio and software synths, although reflexes you learn in FL don't translate directly to other software as much as some. PT is mediocre for the above, Logic better.

If you don't find the basic functions in PTLE easy, then they won't seem easy in any other DAW either.

[snoopy23]

Thanks for all the input, everyone. To answer some of the subsequent questions, I currently record my own bands and other local acts, so I probably won't be doing a lot of ITB composing. Rather, I will be using my DAW to replace my current mixing board/adat set up. I would still prefer to use real effects such as compressors and pre amps, but I am looking forward to having access to a palette of other neat things to play with without getting too lost in the features (I have always been a minimalist as far as processing and signal path go, so I am wary of something that has too many features to spend hours clicking, if you know what I mean). The consensus seems to be Pro Tools and a mac. Once I obtain these items, I will need to find some sort of interface, which raises another question. What kinds of interfaces are user-friendly and will let me record 12-16 tracks at once? I have hear of people using their adats as converters, but I am unsure about the quality, reliability, and actual interfacing procedure to do this. What do you all recommend for getting from the microphone to the monitor screen? Thanks, as usual you never dissapoint.