Mixing a song with 2 drummers

[Milkmansound]

Anyone have any tips for how to do this? Is there a standard practice? One in each ear? One giant out of phase megaset?

I am about to mix a record for a friend, and they have two drummers in the band. This is a huge grey area for me because I have only ever worked with single drummer bands. Wondering what has worked in the past for you folks.

[@?,*???&?]

Here's a disc where panning to the left presents one drummer, panning to the right presents the other drummer- and not just drummer, but trios of performers.

Only King Crimson could pull this off so well:

http://www.amazon.com/THRAK-King-Crimso ... 178&sr=1-1

[MoreSpaceEcho]

never actually mixed two different drummers, but i've mixed multiple tracks of me lots of times....panning 'em can work, sometimes one up the middle and one on the side is cool. or you can do one close one roomy....

your main problem is likely to be flammy kick drums, easiest solution is just make the kick from one kit the dominant one. flammy snares are more acceptable...

[DrummerMan]

Yeah, you could try, like, making one kick drum the "close" kick sound, the other a very roomy sound, both dead center, then pan out the rest of each of the kits left and right, respectively. This is just a random thought going through my head. I've been on a few recordings with other drummers, but can't remember if there was anything drastic on the mixing. I think, mostly, we were making parts that wouldn't get in the way of each other, especially on the kick, so it wouldn't've been as much of an issue as, say, two drummers playing the same back beat.

The Grateful Dead seemed to have the kits pretty hard panned and evenly balanced, volume-wise, in their early recordings, but my memory of it didn't have a lot of low end to the kick sounds. Probably, helped to make it so the psychedelia of it wouldn't mess with the vinyl too much, too. Not that you give a crap about what the Dead did. Just trying to think of some examples....

[DanielJSchlett]

what ive done in the past is kind of pan each kit left and right but not super hard.. and try and leave the bass drums closer to the center... i ran into a problem where a mastering engineer explained he was using an elliptical eq. which sums all low end to mono.. mostly for vinyl i think, but it helps things out a bit i suppose..

like stated above.... pan the presence.... or...dont... who care.. and do what ever sounds good while you are mixing

[Milkmansound]

Not that you give a crap about what the Dead did. Just trying to think of some examples....

ha! Just cause I live in SF...

all of these are good ideas so far. I have been listening to things, and it seems like the post punk way to do it is hard pan the kits. It will definitely depend on a lot of things - I have not even heard the tracks yet! The hard drive arrives tomorrow.

Willie Nelson's Teatro is amazing! Never even knew two drummers could be so cool. Those kits seem to be hard panned as well.

[MoreSpaceEcho]

hard panning's a good idea in general.

[Nate Dort]

Listen to Fugazi's "Ex-Spectator". Two drummers hard-panned.

[mikeyc]

Matthew Sweet's "Thunderstorms" 2 drummers. Cool stuff. I think they were panned to either side as well.

[Marc Alan Goodman]

Yeah, it's pretty free territory. I think you can do whatever the hell you want. Panning hard seems to be the most used solution (and I've done it plenty of times) but consider trying some other things. Like maybe reversing the perspective on one and doing them both in stereo. Try something crazy and let us know how it sounds!

[thethingwiththestuff]

yeah, someone mentioned late Fugazi... that Argument record is one of the best examples of modern two-drum records. "Wonderful and Frightening World of The Fall" is a good example of post-punk, more sloppy, kit + aux percussion feels. that record often seems like there's one kick up the center and two sets of snares toms and cymbals hard panned.

Fiona Apple's When the Pawn... is a fantastic drum record, with lots of varied drum sounds/kits often in the same song, but not necessarily "two drummers."

as always, live arrangement is what will make this work.... that fugazi record makes great use of having one drummer playing the backbeat on the hats, and the other playing a syncopation with the ride... and the fills are well placed.

[kingtoad]

I think a lot of it depends on how the drums were tracked - at the same time/in the same room or seperately, how many mics were used etc. If the kits were tracked live in the same room then your panning options might be basically chosen for you anyway.

[mr.adambeck]

I have a similar question. My band is recording in a couple weeks with me acting (and I do mean acting ) as producer. We have a "normal" drummer (ie: kick, snare, three toms, crash, ride, hi hat) as well as a member of the band who plays a floor tom on some songs, and another member of the band who plays a floor tom and a snare on some songs.

We're recording all the drums at one time.

My question is how to plat the drums in the room. I'd kind of like to have the additional drums sort of panned to the left and right of the "normal" kit, but then I was thinking since we're recording in a rather large, nice drum room, would it be better to have them further away? If I have them close to the kit, should I have each additional drummer on a side, or put them both away from the "normal" drummers floor tom?

On a couple songs I'm guessing the additional drums will not have direct mics very up in the mix, just in the room, and on others I'm guessing they would be more up front... So I guess I need both options available.

Any thoughts would be appreciated!

[LazarusLong]

mono overheads can make life easier here if you want them to be more separated sounding.

[Milkmansound]

just got the tracks - drums are on 8 tracks total. Kicks, Snares, and Stereo overheads for each kit. They made rough mixes and had the kits panned already one to each side... guess that answers that question!

the rough tracks sound pretty good - this is going to be a fun project!