Mixing things louder without it sounding messy?

vivalastblues · Post by **vivalastblues** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:05 pm

Whenever I start compressing things and making them louder in Logic I always end up with a louder but way messier mix. Am I doing something wrong in tracking or should I not be trying to mix loud? I 'master' my stuff myself so I'm trying to get things to be as loud as they should.

I record on tape (8-track) and then bounce to computer.

drumsound · Post by **drumsound** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 12:37 am

Compression adds harmonic distortion. EQ a bit of the mess out and you should be good.

MoreSpaceEcho · Post by **MoreSpaceEcho** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:47 am

don't try and master your stuff while you're mixing. just mix them to sound good and then worry about the mastering end of it.

Z-Plane · Post by **Z-Plane** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:59 am

Not trying to be a smartass, just going through the basics - loud things need space to be loud, and also need to be surrounded by quiet things. How many things are you trying to have loud at once ? How many quiet things surround these ? Mastering is well past the stage of deciding what should be loud in a mix, you might just need more quiet things, and that can be achieved by panning and EQ as much as levels and compression. The more compression you apply, the more space you eat up, and you are relying on that space to allow the loud things to cut through.

Dakota · Post by **Dakota** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:09 am

MoreSpaceEcho wrote:don't try and master your stuff while you're mixing. just mix them to sound good and then worry about the mastering end of it.

+1!

A good clear mix can be mastered up to loud. With a messy mix, mastering is about hiding the flaws.

@?,*???&? · Post by **@?,*???&?** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 11:12 am

drumsound wrote:Compression adds harmonic distortion. EQ a bit of the mess out and you should be good.

Man, here's some completely incorrect information!

LazarusLong · Post by **LazarusLong** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 11:27 am

drumsound wrote:Compression adds harmonic distortion. EQ a bit of the mess out and you should be good.

I've never heard this. I could see it creating momentary distortion at the moment that the gain reduction begins as there's a voltage (or modeled voltage) change over time... but something that warrants EQing?

@?,*???&? · Post by **@?,*???&?** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 11:33 am

LazarusLong wrote:
drumsound wrote:Compression adds harmonic distortion. EQ a bit of the mess out and you should be good.
I've never heard this. I could see it creating momentary distortion at the moment that the gain reduction begins as there's a voltage (or modeled voltage) change over time... but something that warrants EQing?

It changes the waveform envelope (i.e. attack, decay, sustain, release), but not the contents of the complex wave.

Artifex · Post by **Artifex** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 11:41 am

@?,*???&? wrote:
drumsound wrote:Compression adds harmonic distortion. EQ a bit of the mess out and you should be good.
Man, here's some completely incorrect information!

Man, Jeff is so happy to have something to argue about in this thread!

MoreSpaceEcho · Post by **MoreSpaceEcho** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 11:46 am

@?,*???&? wrote:It changes the waveform envelope (i.e. attack, decay, sustain, release), but not the contents of the complex wave.

care to explain what exactly you mean by 'contents'?

thethingwiththestuff · Post by **thethingwiththestuff** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 12:05 pm

yeah, i could swear the contents of a wave include harmonic overtones.

i've also heard people occasionally use compressors to drive things almost to distortion, radically altering the balance of overtones in the original signal.

cgarges · Post by **cgarges** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 12:27 pm

Artifex wrote:Man, Jeff is so happy to have something to argue about in this thread!

subatomic pieces wrote:In other interesting news: The sun rose in the East this morning.

suppositron · Post by **suppositron** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 12:39 pm

thethingwiththestuff wrote:yeah, i could swear the contents of a wave include harmonic overtones.

i've also heard people occasionally use compressors to drive things almost to distortion, radically altering the balance of overtones in the original signal.

Right. Especially when the attack and release times are too short.

@?,*???&? · Post by **@?,*???&?** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 1:52 pm

thethingwiththestuff wrote:yeah, i could swear the contents of a wave include harmonic overtones.

i've also heard people occasionally use compressors to drive things almost to distortion, radically altering the balance of overtones in the original signal.

Complex waves have many components. Frequencies of a sound are related to pitch, timbre, overtones and related harmonic series. The waverform envelope would contain all of these things independent of the amount of compression.

The statement above said that 'compression adds harmonic distortion' which simply isn't the case, but it will change the waveform envelope.

drumsound · Post by **drumsound** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 4:28 pm

@?,*???&? wrote:
thethingwiththestuff wrote:yeah, i could swear the contents of a wave include harmonic overtones.

i've also heard people occasionally use compressors to drive things almost to distortion, radically altering the balance of overtones in the original signal.
Complex waves have many components. Frequencies of a sound are related to pitch, timbre, overtones and related harmonic series. The waverform envelope would contain all of these things independent of the amount of compression.

The statement above said that 'compression adds harmonic distortion' which simply isn't the case, but it will change the waveform envelope.

Would you prefer "can" add distortion?

Either way, split all the hairs and spout all the "I know more than you" statements you like.

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Mixing things louder without it sounding messy?

Mixing things louder without it sounding messy?

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