Drum Miking/Recording

[Randyrhoads1981]

Hello, I am new to the world of Recording as well
as TapeOp. I have a Home Studio and I record to Tape(1" 16-Track).
I am thinking of how many Mics I will "need"
to get a nice full sounding Drum take.

My original idea was to Mic everything.
But when I took my Shure Beta57 around the
Drum-set, I found that one mic can easily pickup
more than one drum and multiple Mics can
even cause more phase problems.

So... I was wondering what would be the bare minimum
as to how many mics I'd need for a great Drum sound?
Which Toms should I Mic, if any?

Here are my Microphone choices:
Kick) Shure Beta52 or AKG D112
Snare and Toms) Shure SM57's
Overheads) Oktava MK-012's

This is a great Forum and Magazine.
I enjoy being here very much.
Thanks,
-Thomas

[The Scum]

The bare minimum: one mic.

One mic can be plenty, until it becomes too few.

If you dig here a bit, you'll find people who use one, two, three, four, and more mics. There are some fairly sophisticated discussions relating to each of those options.

Some keywords to help find those discussions:
PZM, boundary, Blumlein, ORTF, Jecklin, Recorderman, Glyn Johns.

[jnTracks]

+1

for pre-pro demo's i often do two. kick and overhead.

if you wanted a stereo image out of two mics i'd try something i learned a long time ago.
with two small diaphragm condensers, have the drummer sit at the kit and point their elbows straight out from their shoulders. place the two SDC's at the elbows pointed at the center of the kit. you'll have to listen and move the mic's around very carefully to find the perfect spot, but there is a spot in there where the phase will line up and produce a full, stereo image. with just phase.

we did this in audio school one day. it took almost an hour just to find the spot (with direction from Al Shapiro, who was teaching the class) but when it lined up it was crazy good.

[farview]

You could also try a beta 52 in the vent hole of the kick, 57 on the snare and two octava's for overheads. On placed a few feet above the high tom and one over the floor tom.

The trick is to make both overheads about the same distance away from the snare. Depending on the way the drummer sets his drumset up, you will have to play with the positioning of the overheads.

[darjama]

My general rule: The better sounding the room, the fewer mics you need. So if I'm recording in space that's untreated and/or sub-optimal in shape/ceiling height, I'll close-mic the toms and keep the overheads tighter in.

Since you're doing this analog, if you're tight on tracks, you can try recording the overheads and toms as a stereo submix.

Of course we don't know what style of music you're talking about, close micing everything might be inappropriate.

[chris harris]

Yeah, what kind of sound are you trying to get?

[ott0bot]

As stated it definately depends on the type of music and the sound you're going for. From your other posts, it seems like a alt country/indie rock sorta thing....so it's really up to you. For that type of music, I go with kick, snare and at least a mono overhead/shoulder mic/right side mic. The kick and snare really make a nice simple back beat, and they make room for other instruments...so they are assisting the song, not leading it.

The trick with a single mic, is getting a balanced picture of the kit (if you even want that). And, as stated the room has alot to do with that. The drums and how there played make a huge difference too. If you have a cymbal smasher you probably don't want a true overhead or it'll sound like a truck of hubcabs just jackknifed on a concrete slab. But if you place it behind the drummer, then you lose the thump of the kick. It does sound cool as heck to me if you set up a cheap omni (635a for me) as a room mic and smash the heck out of it with a real colored comp, but that only works on certain songs.

Thats why I've never really been satisfied with a single mic. I usually go with 3 at minimum. Usually glyn johns.....then I'll add a snare and room mic, and maybe a tom mic if the song needs it. Really analyze the room, the sound of the kit and the drummer, then do your best to capture what is there. That's my usual MO.

[Wlouch]

My general rule: The better sounding the room, the fewer mics you need. So if I'm recording in space that's untreated and/or sub-optimal in shape/ceiling height, I'll close-mic the toms and keep the overheads tighter in.

Since you're doing this analog, if you're tight on tracks, you can try recording the overheads and toms as a stereo submix.

Of course we don't know what style of music you're talking about, close micing everything might be inappropriate.

A great rule of thumb. For drums, what would you say is a good ceiling height, approximately?

[darjama]

For drums, what would you say is a good ceiling height, approximately?

I'd say good starts at about 12 feet.

[MoreSpaceEcho]

i'd be inclined to agree. but most people don't have the luxury of such high ceilings, and fortunately you can get away with a lot lower if you treat the area over the drums with a bunch of 703. in fact you should still do this even if you do have a high ceiling.

[Wlouch]

Yeah I have self made panels ready to float above the "drum area" in my live room. The ceiling is around 3m or so, a little lower than ideal, but plenty of room to sound live and big.

[ott0bot]

I have been tracking drums in my living room with 10-11 ft high ceilings. They work fine....as long as I keep the relctions under control with some kind of absorbtion technique. Use a blanket if you have to, or some high density foam, at least something to cut down on the reflected sound.

If you want to do something a little better you could use some 2" owc 703 panels, cover them with fabric, then get the special self drilling anchors for ridid fiberglass an put 3 or four in the back 5-6 inches from the edges. Attach a small length of chain to each anchor. The put the same amount of screw hooks into the closest support beams in the ceiling in a similar position. If there are no beams close enough, at least use those drywall screws with anchors. Then you can hang them when you want and remove them if you want reflections. You can also vary the height and angles by which chain link you hang from.

[Wlouch]

I have a load of panels ready, most of which have a french cleat attachment so i can move them around the walls wherever i want when i want. The ceiling attaching method hasnt been thought about as yet, but that sounds perfect. Thanks for that.

[Randyrhoads1981]

Yeah, what kind of sound are you trying to get?

Well, I'm trying to get several sounds.
Off the top of my head, I'd say a Stewart
Copeland and John Bonham.
I like a tight but still airy and open,
if that makes any sense. Dense but open haha.
I REALLY like the typical drum sounds of classic
1970's rock i.e. Genesis, Rush, Heart, Led Zeppelin, etc.

[Randyrhoads1981]

You could also try a beta 52 in the vent hole of the kick, 57 on the snare and two octava's for overheads. On placed a few feet above the high tom and one over the floor tom.

That's what I was thinking:
Kick, Snare, and Overheads.
Seems like enough; not too much and
not too little to work with.